My question is what other options do I have for fuel injectors with my 90 integra. I have some DSM 450cc injectors, but they need to be refurbished. I am wondering what other injectors I can use for my OBD0 ECU. I already have it chipped with Turboedit from chris, so I don’t want to change ecu. If i use the 440cc injectors I will have to reburn my chip as well I take it. Is it as easy as buying some rc 440cc and the obd1 connectors and re wiring them. Anyway I searched and could not find a good answer.
Also were is a good place to get the injectors refurbished, and how much does it usually cost.
IMO stick with the 450’s and get them refirbished, its only $12 an injector. If your sticking with TurboEdit it will be MUCH easier to find maps, as most peeps use the 450’s.
rc’s will work with obd0 plugs as well (ive used obd0 accord plugs)
i hate 450’s…they are like the cheap way out of injectors lol. plus i didnt feel safe since they werent that big, if i spiked i owuldnt have enough fuel to try n save my motor. id go with some 550’s (i use to run 880’s on my stock ls since 550cc-880cc injectors are the same price) and just get retuned. you will like how much smoother the car feels on rc’s or ne other after market injectors as well.
i would look toward getting some 550’s or something also, since this seems like a good time to. i bought 440’s, and im regretting it. according to my uberdata duty cycle, they are pulling around 90% at 8.5 psi at 7000 rpms. not only does this put a tight cap on how much boost i can run, but what civicflnum1 said holds true too.
tuner toys makes obd0 550’s i believe. they are very reasonably priced, and i dont think ive ever heard anything seriously bad about them
Uberdata’s duty cycle calculation is WAY off…dont believe it.
450s are perfectly fine. I got mine for $50 from the forums and they have been running hard on two setups and up to 250 hp at the stock rail pressure (42 psi).
You could really up that to 50psi or so and be good up to 300hp.
Unless you have the $$$ to burn or a serious need to be over 300 Hp, dont waste the money.
Why bump fuel psi and run a high duty cycle (300whp is pushing it) if theres a chance on a boost spike? id spend the extra money…if your tight on cash boost isnt for you.
Dont tell me whats right for me ass bag, and no 300 whp is not ‘pushing it.’ What is wrong with perfectly good 450cc injectors that came from a vehicle manufacturer? If you have a major spike and you arent looking, you are fucked anyway, your ECU isnt going to account for such a large spike (unless you have a larger than stock MAP sensor) and you will lean out and detonate anyways.
And you bump fuel pressure so that you can run a lower duty cycle. More fuel pressure means more flow through the injector at the same duty cycle so by bumping the base fuel pressure, you can run more fuel through the same injector. Its like making a 450 injector run like a 550 injector, you just have to up the fuel pressure. There is nothing wrong with it (unless you go too high) and its exactly what FMU’s do. However, they raise fuel pressure based on a boost signal effectively adding more and more fuel at the same injector pulsewidth which isnt very ‘tuned’ and FMUs do run exceedingly high pressures which isnt great…
ok first of all what crawled up your ass? did i call you names? no…shows how mature you are. second of all, most people who boost ls’s (that acutally like making power) push more than 11psi so they usually have a larger map sensor. Also your right…they came from a manufatored car…chances are they are gonna have lots of miles on them so they might not flow as well anyway so why spend money on the dsm’s, then more to clean n flow test…when u can get new ones for alittle more? also with huge injectors and a bigger map u can tune for spikes (add lots of fuel and pull timing) and if your lucky the car will die with out major engine damage.
still they are 450cc’s which isnt big. even at a 50psi base pressure @ 300whp DSM’s are gonna be up in mid 90% duty cycle range…to me thats unsafe. maybe you like risking motors but i dont.
And I dont see how a larger map sensor would do anything, lol. Perhaps one the same size that reads boost! Also, larger map? Is that so you can see it better? Dont mean to come off as a dick, im just good at it.
You seem close on your knowledge, but not quite there yet!!!
I’m gonna take xenocron’s side on this one.
yeah its a thing called tuning…when my ls spun a bearing i ran the 880’s on my stock sohc whats the problem?
ok lets see if i can make it simple for you…a stock mapsensor reads up to 11psi so if you have a 18psi spike its only gonna give you enough fuel for 11psi…there for you will gernade your motor…a 3 bar reads up to 28psi or something like that if im not mistaken. so if you ran 11 psi on a 3 bar and had a 18psi spike your motor will be fine if you add enough fuel for it (dont say it will still blow cause my stock ls has seen 20psi spikes a few times). therefore yes, a larger (3bar map is bigger than stock since stock reads 11psi n a 3bar reads 28psi+/-) map sensor WILL and can save your motor…i know if i spiked 20 psi on my stock map the motor would of went bye bye. Maybe you should spend some time reading about forced indution before you make posts. i come off as a dick as well :giggle:
Hmmmmmmm, well I guess I have always been under the impression that stock map sensors dont read boost, but I guess I never considered the fact that that’s probably because there is no stock map for positive manifold pressure. Perhaps you are right about the stock sensor. I never doubted your reasoning for needing a “bigger” sensor, theoretically it makes sense. I was just pointing it out cuz I never considered one map sensor “bigger” than another, although I have never even seen a GM 3bar map sensor, so once again, you could be right about it being larger in physical size. I mistook your use of the word bigger for you thinking that the actual sensor needed to be physically bigger in order to read more boost or something! SO, I stand corrected.
I do, however, still question running 880cc injectors in a stock motor, even when you can remap the fuel tables to make it run. Once again, I’ve been under the impression (from a very reputable engine builder) that its best to run the smallest injector that can safely support your goals for your motor. Otherwise, why do they even sell small injectors??? Why wouldnt everyone just run huge ass injectors all the time???
the reason i ran 880’s on a stock sohc is because i was too lazy to take the resistor box off the car and stock injectors are high impedence not low impedence so they wont work with a resistor box. so i put the 880’s from the LS-Turbo on the sohc and just made a quick map…quite easy and alot less work then removing the resistor box (i also used the 3bar on the stock sohc lol)
Seems to me that you are critizing the majority of the people who run 450cc injectors and cite 'Safety & Precautionary" reasons to back up your OPINION.
Yet you stated as fact that you ran around boosted and saw 18-20psi spikes on your setup.
See now I would prefer to put together a combination (turbo, manifold, wastegate) that was designed correctly to not spike and keep a stable boost level. Seems that there would be much more risk in running a setup that KNOWINGLY spikes on occasion than running used injectors that MIGHT fail.
Also, any EMS that will allow you to run larger injectors and/or MAP sensor should also let you preset a BOOST CUT level. So that instead of letting your setup spike to 18-20 psi, why dont you just set the boost cut to 1 psi above your desired boost level and cut it safely, because, 18-20 psi on a stock block motor can and will cause problems if it happens enough, even if you do setup the fueling & ignition to accomodate those
CLIFF NOTES:
-You criticize people for using 450 injectors for safety reasons, yet you turn around and tell people you run a setup that spikes to 18-20psi and you dont set a boost cut in your engine management that would be safer than letting it spike all the way up there, even with extra fuel and pulled timing.
:lol:
Also, seems like you have had your way with a few motors as is, not sure I personally would be willing to take any of the shit-advice you’ve been posting for the past few days here it seems, everyone else is free to make up their own opinion of course.
Please show me how i critized. i simply said youd like the smoothness of aftermarket injectors not injectors that are a few years old and have many miles on them, then when people bitch about spending 200 bucks for injectors i tell them dont boost the shit if they are broke. :roll:
since you open your mouth when you dont know what your talking about ill be more than happy to explain AFTER you posted and BEFORE you asked why it spiked to 20 psi a few times. i just got the profec b spec2 and i was learning how to use it…coudlnt figure it out and i would hit it to see if it was working…it would hit 20psi id let off…play with it, hit it and it would hit 20psi again and id let off…it had nothing to do with the turbo, mani, wg. maybe you should ask questions before you post :roll:
also it didnt spike on occasion, i said a few times…the few times is when i was playing with the spec 2…you really like opening your mouth and saying shit when you dont have a clue what your saying don’t ya? reading is your friend…you should try it sometime
at the time uberdata’s boost cut was iffy and had bugs…this wasnt yesterday it was many months ago almost a year :roll:
id rather :bang: then argure with you cause its pointless. you sound like a dumb ass who opens his mouth about crap he doesnt even know. stick a fork in a power outlet
since you missed it the other 20 times, ill post it one more time for ya
since you open your mouth when you dont know what your talking about ill be more than happy to explain AFTER you posted and BEFORE you asked why it spiked to 20 psi a few times. i just got the profec b spec2 and i was learning how to use it…coudlnt figure it out and i would hit it to see if it was working…it would hit 20psi id let off…play with it, hit it and it would hit 20psi again and id let off…it had nothing to do with the turbo, mani, wg. maybe you should ask questions before you post
::sigh:: im sure you can reach the floor by now i mean hell this guys nuts have got to be sagging by now…if your gonna post, atleast try to shut one of us up…its more fun that way :whore:
