which one would be better between the AEM cold air intake and the K & N FIPK system? the K & N says that it can add up to 26 hp, but it doesn’t cool the air flowing into the engine. would it be better to have cold air?
there are sooooooooooooooo many threads answering and dealing with this topic. whether it be aem, k&n, iceman, injen, generic ebay, bomz…etc.
please search for it.
aem comes in either cold air or short ram. the k&n is a short ram intake. use keywords:
- short ram
- cold air
- aem
- injen
- bomz
- ambient air
search.
in short, no intake system will give you 26hp. most you will get with a cold air is 4-6hp, if your lucky. 2-3hp with short ram. as for cooling air, once the car is moving the air temperature will be ambient.
what is better depends on your engine setup, hp goals, and preferred hp at certain rpm.
apexi on an ebay pipe!
do you think that i haven’t searched? i searched and found about 3 threads that were relative to my question. not sooooooooooo many. i’ve looked at the thread about cold air vs. short ram, but i was asking about two different brands. thanks though… anyone else?
a intake is a intake…diameter and length of the pipe plays a big role…i believe k & n make the aem filters…
gotta spoon-fed again i guess. i’ll answer your questions which if you actually researched and applied the basic principles of intake design theory, you would have realized that you aren’t really comparing the brand aem vs. k&n. what you are really comparing is a cold air vs. short ram system. in other words aem(cold air) vs. k&n(short ram).
since you asked which is better between an aem vs. k&n.
aem makes a cold air intake and a short ram. where as k&n makes a short ram. since you asked which one is better, you are actually asking is cold air better than short ram. like i have mentioned before, a cold air or short ram needs is solely based upon your engine setup, hp goals, and where you want your powerband. some prefer the low-mid range gains of a cold air, some need the higher gains of a short ram. main difference between the two “brands” is the pipe length and diameter. there is not an intake that is necessary better than one another. what is better depends on what you need.
next you asked would it be better to have cold air. what is better depends on your engine setup. remember that once the car is moving the air under the hood is ambient to outside air. so the term cold air intake is a bit misleading as the real gains are in the design.
and no intake can cool the air that it is inhaling.
info that i have posted before in a previous thread discussing intakes:
a very handy link for intake information
automotivetech.org…=&threadid=3956
here are some key excerpts from it.
"A. Short Ram vs CAI (single chamber)
When hooked up to a single stage runner intake manifold (like the ITR IM) , the AEM CAI provides some gains in the upper rpms and a big increase in power from 4000-5000 rpm ( known as the " AEM hump" where it was first seen. ).
However, does a CAI make more power than a short ram with the same diameter and filter material?
For enthusiasts with single stage runner intake manifolds and mega cams that can rev up to 9000 rpm or more, the AEM/Injen- style CAI actually stops making more power after 8000-8300 rpm . The gain in power for AEM that is quoted in the ads occur at the famous “AEM hump” and not in the upper rpms after 7000 rpm.
Believe it or not, a short ram with the same diameter does pretty well in the upper rpm range from 7000-9000 rpm !
Is it just about getting “colder air” that makes the CAI appear to be better? What role does the intake tube’s length play in making big all motor power? Is having a “constant diameter” (constant velocity) different from having a “tapered diameter” tube like the J’s intake?
Let’s look at this AEM hump. You may not have noticed this isolated gain from 4000-5000 rpm before on the AEM CAI’s and single stage manifolds but look at any Integra LS, Type R, or Civic B16a dyno with an AEM CAI and there it is sticking out like a sore thumb by itself…this is what most people “feel” as a noticeable gain on the butt dyno after installing one of these. The more relevant gains at the upper rpms where the fast 11-12 sec et all motor street cars make power are not “felt” by the butt dyno. Don’t rely on the butt dyno to tell if you are faster."
"The temperature differential between the outside ambient temp. and engine bay temp. under the hood at the short ram intake opening has been measured while an Integra is travelling at speed. There is virtually no difference in temperature. We can expect the temp/ effect between short ram vs. CAI to be not as big as people think. "
:Some short ram people would say that bigger VTEC race cams would really show how good a short ram can be above 6500 rpm.
For now, Steven Sakai’s performance at the 2000 final and Val’s dyno (the only one comparing the same diameter) basically says there is no difference, as long as you get the diameter right (i.e. more than 3 in. ID in a single chamber design).
It makes scientific sense from a fluid dynamics point of view :
A bigger diameter tube allows more air to go in but at a slower speed (more cross sectional area). The air flow speed needed to make peak volumetric efficiency occurs at a higher rpm compared to a smaller diameter tube.
A longer tube creates faster air flow compared to a short tube (i.e. more pressure differential from the opening to the TB end) and peak volumetric efficiency will occur at an earlier (i.e. lower) rpm. This is why a longer CAI has an advantage in the midrange over a short ram, regardless of intake temperature differences.
Some people prefer short rams and need their powerband to be higher with bigger cams. They get around the temperature controversy by building their own short ram heat shield"
"D. So What Are the Differences in CAI Designs?
- Diameter
The AEM 3 in. is shared by the Injen’s. They both have a constant diameter throughout their entire length (constant velocity design) and are not tapered.
The Iceman and J’s Racing uses a tapered design going from 3.5 in. to 2.75 in. at the TB. Tapered designs generate more flow velocity than constant diameter designs. There is more lowend to midrange power in a tapered design for better engine acceleration. More about the relevance of this later on below. "
"3. Bypass valve or Other Hydrolock Prevention Measures and Filter Elements
Wire mesh like on a Blitz intake flows better than foam , oiled K&N, and paper but filters the least efficiently. Foam flows better than the K&N but again does not filter out particles and debris as well. Paper elements filters the best but flows the least.
It seems to me, the K&N type has the best balance of flow and filtering ability, although the other manufacturers of filters will use the marketing “scare tactic” that the oil eventually leaches out from the K&N and deposits on the inside of the intake tube and into the engine itself. It’s not a compelling or convincing argument to choose a non-K&N since the original filtering ability (of dirt and debris) is more important to me .
The AEM has the bypass valve and K&N filter element. The Comptech Icebox is basically a larger box version of the stock intake without a resonator and so does not run as much of a hydrolock risk since it’s similar to the stock layout. The Comptech uses a foam filter element. PRM moved the filter element back up under the hood but uses a washable gauze material and has a cylindrical filter chamber rather than a pressurized box. Injen’s 1 piece Competition CAI does not have a bypass valve but they do carry a line of 2 piece short rams with CAI extension. The Iceman is a short ram with a CAI extension as well. So when it rains,with the Injen 2 piece and Iceman, you can revert to a short ram. They both use K&N like filter elements with a velocity stack-ram air effect inside the filter.
BTW I’m told by Jeff Schaeffer that you can attach the AEM bypass to the Iceman CAI if you have hydrolock anxiety. You just need to cut the Iceman at the same location as where AEM places their bypass. You’re pretty brave to hack up a perfectly good intake and lose 2-3 whp across the board, (IMHO).
- Materials
AEM, Icebox, and Injen use metal. Iceman and PRM use plastic. J’s racing and Top fuel offers carbon fiber short ram intakes . Now which one of these materials do you think serves as a better heat sink and can potentially warm up the cold air once it travels into the engine bay portion of the tube? (see intake wrap discussion below). Carbon fiber does not hold heat either."
"Velocity Stack Opening Importance
Assures that no cavitation bubble forms at the opening of the intake to generate excessive pressure and turbulence to disrupt flow away from the intake opening. If there wasn’t a 3 degree radius at the lip of the opening flow would have a tendency to go around the intake opening rather than into it."
yep, an intake is just an intake. focus should be on design. k&n used to make aem filters, now aem has their “own” filters, which i believe is still made by k&n.
yo spikey mike…did you just copy and past that long post of yours…haha…
it’s not that the noobs have the answer…it’s just that they’re all stuck at phase one which is the i/h/c/e…
we as all import lovers have come a long way, so no disrespect to the noobs, but please search as all questions relating to i/h/c/e have been discussed and beaten to death and beaten some more…we all want to advance to the next stage but we can’t advance because alot of the noobs are bringing back beaten threads…so please do yourself a favor and search…
spikeymike, said it the best…find out what your goal is on your car and from there you can decide what parts are best suited for it.
we don’t like stepping back to five years ago…
hehe yep, copied and pasted what i wrote in a previous thread. hahahah i should have just posted the link huh?
thank you for your help. i dont know half as much about my car as you probably do, but i try to learn. i don’t have enough money for new cams, or turbo, or anything, i’m still in high school. i don’t see why u get mad because u know way more than people, but hey, thanks. that article helped a lot.