ok did compression test a few hours ago and just put the spark plugs back in and started the car, or so i thoguht. it won’t fire up!
anyway i was wondering if there is something that is supposed to be unhooked on an MSD ignition when cranking with no plugs inserted.
also any other ideas on why car won’t start are appreciated.
i’m assuming you have checked the coil wire ???
Have you checked for Spark at all ???
are you sure you have your wires on correctly ??
i know these are sum silly Q’s but i know some one will ask them … Might as well be me… lol
i’ve checked for a spark and i do have one
and the wires are definately still in the right order because i didn’t remove them fromt he distributor when we did the test.
i’m going to remove my spark plugs and let it sit overnight. hopefully it’s just flooded.
does anyone have any idea what else it might be?
If you did a compression test only pulling the plug wires off the plugs without pulling the power or fuse to your ignition you likely destroyed, burnt the coil and possible the ignighter. I learned the expensive way also. Because the increased current supplied by the MSD amplifier normally going to the plugs has nowhere to go when you crank the engine, it finds an outlet by over heating the coil and ignighter until it shorts out. Try just replacing the coil first. When mine happened the coil itself had a burn mark that was visible on the outside of the case. Use the resistance test procedure in the Helms manual to check the coil. Remember to pull the fuse next time and let me know what it was when you solve the problem.
i was afraid something like that might be the case. but on the other hand, would i have a spark at all if that happened?
also for future reference, exactly what fuse should i remove to prevent this problem?
one other question. what exactly is the igniter? i just looked all thru the service manual and didn’t see it mentioned once
coil test results:
primary .7 ohm
secondary 11370 ohms
i realize secondary is a little low, but it seems that if the coil were burnt it would be way off, not just a little
someone please help, i’m running out of time and my fathers birthday is this weekend, i need to be able to make the hour drive home!
one other question. what exactly is the igniter? i just looked all thru the service manual and didn’t see it mentioned once
The igniter is the small piece inside your distributor that sends the primary voltage to the coil which is then sent to the spark plug. It receives its input from the ECU and also supplies the output tach signal for your tachometer. Since it works closesly with your coil, it is something to suspect when not getting a proper spark, but judging by your coil resistance values, I’d suspect the coil itself. When I get home, I will check the spec range for the coil values, but I think by looking at the figures you got, you may need a new coil regardless. I’ll double check that later.
If you want to eliminate a possible cause for your problem, try hooking the coil back up straight to the igniter like it’s supposed to be for stock. If it starts working, your MSD is the culprit. If it still doesn’t work, it may be the MSD still, but more likely it’s your coil or ingitor, judging by the reliability reputation of our stock coils and igniters being not the greatest.
the specs on resitance are 0.6 to 0.8 ohm for primary and 12,800 to 19,200 ohms for secondary.
checking for spark i get a strong blue spark, which seems to tell me that the coil is fine. also being that i have any spark at all that totally rules out the igniter. i’m going to try and borrow brad’s ignition coil and see if that does it, rather than shelling out the $70 on a hunch.
i have reset the ecu, changed plugs back to an old set i had that still worked, pulled the plugs to relieve flooding, checked spark, checked fuel. i can’t think of anything else but still the car won’t start!
i really don’t want to unhook the MSD since i don’t have the wiring diagram with me at school, as well as not having all of the connecters i need. i would think that’s not the reason for my problem if i am getting spark though. i guess i’ll try that next if swapping coils doesn’t work.
someone anyone please help me!
addendum: i am also not throwing any codes at the ecu, it just blinks once when i turn it to on, which i believe it is supposed to do
i really don’t want to unhook the MSD since i don’t have the wiring diagram with me at school
I think they have all the schematics on their website. You should check there. While your there you should also check over some troubleshooting tips and see what they recommend.
In all actuality, I dont think your ignition is to blame if your getting spark to the plugs.
Later,
BR
cables
Have you checked the cables?
If you have spark, then I think you’re barking up the wrong tree by going after the coil and igniter and such.
It’s possible that you damaged the cables when you pulled them off the plugs in order to do the compression test, and now you have one of two problems.
By the way. Have you made sure that the metal contact in side the rubber boot is making contact with the spark plug. I’ve seen people before pull the cable off the plug by pulling on the cable itself, then when they put it back, the metal contact in the boot has slid up and is not making contact with the top of the spark plug.
Ok, so you have spark - yes, that would rule out the igniter and coil. Like David said, check the wires. One other thing not mentioned but should be checked is that your ground cable from your chassis to your head is properly secure. Since it provides some grounding for the actual head and thus spark plugs (Honda put it there for a reason), make sure it’s on a valve cover to head stud and not just one of the nuts that attaches to the valve cover only, since the latter would not help in providing a good ground to the head because the valve cover at that point would be insulated by the valve cover rubber gasket. That’s why the OEM ground strap branches to two points on the engine to get a better ground to the head.
Just another possiblily and something simple you can double check.
You might have bad ground to your msd.
I have accel ingition and I went and cranked and nothing happened. Well to find out, the spark was jumping onto a ground source. So it wasn’t starting because the thing was basically touching the ground (negative on the battery or the chassis).
I would check this out first before anything, I reinstalled the whole system with a more secure ground and made sure nothing could “jump” or the spark couldn’t jump. Now everything is all gravy.
ok, i’ve upgraded the ground cable between the valve cover and the chassis to a 4 ga and 10 ga, respectively on the valve cover. i’m sure that’s not the problem. also i’m sure the MSD is grounded fine because everything worked fine before i did the compression test. none of those grounds would have changed.
did you check your cap and rotor?
for what? they’re less than a month old. there was light scorching on the rotor, but it wiped away. if that were the problem i’d have no spark, which i have
At this point since it’s confirmed you have spark and you are positive your electrical system is functioning fine, I can only suggest the fuel system: Check to see that your fuel pump works and that you are getting fuel pressure up to your fuel rail. After that, check all your fuses for blown fuel delivery system components. If I get a revelation in my sleep, I’ll wake up and post the idea here. Sorry Andy, I wish I could think of something else right now.
ok, i can’t believe just how bad my week continues to get. i finally gave up and just said fug it, i’ll buy a coil. so i go to my local autozone (my last choice but it was the only place open this late) and get the last coil they have on the shelf. i ask if they can test it real quick before i leave, and he tells me they don’t have anything to test it with. whatever you anothony montoya sounding motherfucker. so we go back and i test it before i put it in a low and behold, it’s farther out of spec than my current one!
CAN ANYTHING ELSE GO WRONG HERE:mad:
so i also unhooked my MSD and i’m going to try it with the new coil and no MSD and then the old coil with no MSD. i’m at the end of my sanity here
edit: well i just tried it with the newer crappier coil and also with the MSD unhooked and i’ve still got no luck. even with the crappier coil i’ve got a bright blue spark. i just don’t get it. i think we’re going to head out to meijer and get a can of ether and just shoot it down the throttle body and pray. if that doesn’t do it nothing will…
and then comes the TNT
one new development to the saga…
we just did another compression test (with the engine cold of course). cylinders 1-3 all went up to about 180-200 and then slowly dropped off (escaping around the rings because the motor is cold). cylinder 4 however only made it up to about 130 psi, and that was with a lot more cranks than the other cylinders. it also just slowly tapered off.
could this have anything to do with anything?