MAP sensor code after fuel filter replacement

I’ve been searching this site for a couple hours looking for an answer, but I think this is a somewhat unique situation. I’m going to get a little detailed here, in case something I think is a coincidence is actually relevant, and to answer any initial questions you may have for me before giving an opinion.

I picked up a 92 GS-R a couple weeks ago. Rough paint and interior, 195,000 miles, but everything electric works, and the motor seems to be in excellent shape. Everything appears 100% stock. Even the intake and heat shield. I feel like it should be faster than it is, but I’d never driven a GS-R. However, I do “feel” that my 91 GS pulls harder (this is based on no evidence whatsoever, other than my internal G-meter. Ha).

The GS-R had been sitting for at least 9 months, so after running through most of the gas that came with the car, I filled up (10 gallons, so not totally empty) with premium and added a can of 44K (fuel system cleaner).

After that tank ran through and I refilled it again, the car was taking 3-4 minutes of cranking to start, but only on the first start of the day (I deliver pizza so it gets started many times per day). Every other start feels normal. There’s no hesitation, no sputtering, no jumpy idle, no check engine light. Ever.

Checked the cap/rotor/wires. All seem fine.
Replaced the spark plugs with the exact part number on the sticker under the hood, gapped to 1.3mm.
Problem unchanged.

Fast forward a week, and the car is taking less and less cranks to fire up every day. The last 2 days it only took 10-20 seconds (vs 3-4 minutes).

Figuring a fuel filter was the next step, I had that replaced today, along with the power steering high pressure line, and the exhaust return line (not sure what it’s called exactly, the tube that runs from the top of the valve cover back into the intake). The mechanic commented that he thought the old fuel filter he replaced was on backward. Then thought maybe it was just a different design than the new one. Seemed a little unsure.

As I was waiting for them to pull the car around after the work was completed, they came into the lobby to tell me the check engine light is now on. It’s throwing code 5: MAP sensor.

The mechanic said that when he first started it up after the maintenance, one of the vacuum lines wasn’t attached, so he attached it, reset the computer and restarted the car. Code comes back within 2 seconds of startup. He felt bad so he stayed almost 2 hours off the clock after the shop closed to try to figure it out. We reset the computer half a dozen times, after he checked all the vacuum lines, checked the MAP sensor itself, and even replaced the sensor with one from a 93 Prelude they had lying around (he said it’s the same?). No change.
The car runs and drives exactly as before, no hesitation or weird idle, it’s just that this damn light is on.

SO. I think that’s everything. Any help would be MUCH appreciated. I’m not really sure where to go from here.

[QUOTE=moixana;2328826]I’ve been searching this site for a couple hours looking for an answer, but I think this is a somewhat unique situation. I’m going to get a little detailed here, in case something I think is a coincidence is actually relevant, and to answer any initial questions you may have for me before giving an opinion.

I picked up a 92 GS-R a couple weeks ago. Rough paint and interior, 195,000 miles, but everything electric works, and the motor seems to be in excellent shape. Everything appears 100% stock. Even the intake and heat shield. I feel like it should be faster than it is, but I’d never driven a GS-R. However, I do “feel” that my 91 GS pulls harder (this is based on no evidence whatsoever, other than my internal G-meter. Ha).

The GS-R had been sitting for at least 9 months, so after running through most of the gas that came with the car, I filled up (10 gallons, so not totally empty) with premium and added a can of 44K (fuel system cleaner).

After that tank ran through and I refilled it again, the car was taking 3-4 minutes of cranking to start, but only on the first start of the day (I deliver pizza so it gets started many times per day). Every other start feels normal. There’s no hesitation, no sputtering, no jumpy idle, no check engine light. Ever.

Checked the cap/rotor/wires. All seem fine.
Replaced the spark plugs with the exact part number on the sticker under the hood, gapped to 1.3mm.
Problem unchanged.

Fast forward a week, and the car is taking less and less cranks to fire up every day. The last 2 days it only took 10-20 seconds (vs 3-4 minutes).

Figuring a fuel filter was the next step, I had that replaced today, along with the power steering high pressure line, and the exhaust return line (not sure what it’s called exactly, the tube that runs from the top of the valve cover back into the intake). The mechanic commented that he thought the old fuel filter he replaced was on backward. Then thought maybe it was just a different design than the new one. Seemed a little unsure.

As I was waiting for them to pull the car around after the work was completed, they came into the lobby to tell me the check engine light is now on. It’s throwing code 5: MAP sensor.

The mechanic said that when he first started it up after the maintenance, one of the vacuum lines wasn’t attached, so he attached it, reset the computer and restarted the car. Code comes back within 2 seconds of startup. He felt bad so he stayed almost 2 hours off the clock after the shop closed to try to figure it out. We reset the computer half a dozen times, after he checked all the vacuum lines, checked the MAP sensor itself, and even replaced the sensor with one from a 93 Prelude they had lying around (he said it’s the same?). No change.
The car runs and drives exactly as before, no hesitation or weird idle, it’s just that this damn light is on.

SO. I think that’s everything. Any help would be MUCH appreciated. I’m not really sure where to go from here.[/QUOTE]

MAP code 5 indicates a mechanical issue (vs electrical), most likely a vacuum leak.

Go grab a large plastic syringe from any pharmacy and test the lines between the throttle body and map sensor to see if they are holding vacuum. The other thing you can try is disconnect the MAP sensor and go drive around. If the performance of the car changes, you know the MAP sensor itself is probably not the issue.

Sounds to me like you may want to try a new mechanic. Is he familiar with Hondas? It doesn’t sound like he’s following the procedures in the factory service manual. Or perhaps just didn’t have time to complete the full procedure? Typically whenever you have a CEL the best course of action is to follow the troubleshooting procedures laid out in the factory service manual.

Also, the correct spark plug gap is 1.0-1.1mm. 1.3mm is the service limit. The factor service manual states: “Make sure that the 1.3mm plug gauge does not o into he gap for the platinum tip plug. If the gauge goes into the gap, do not attempt to adjust the side electrode; replace plug with a new one.”

Sounds like you already bought platinum plugs but in general I recommend sticking with copper. The only real benefit to platinum is that they can last longer. IMO they aren’t worth the price and I prefer to use standard NGK coppers and just replace them more often.

[QUOTE=enforcer;2328833]MAP code 5 indicates a mechanical issue (vs electrical), most likely a vacuum leak.

Go grab a large plastic syringe from any pharmacy and test the lines between the throttle body and map sensor to see if they are holding vacuum. The other thing you can try is disconnect the MAP sensor and go drive around. If the performance of the car changes, you know the MAP sensor itself is probably not the issue.[/QUOTE]

We both checked the vacuum lines. They all seem fine.

I drove with the MAP sensor unplugged. The car didn’t like that. The tac was definitely unsettled.

[QUOTE=Colin;2328834]Sounds to me like you may want to try a new mechanic. Is he familiar with Hondas? It doesn’t sound like he’s following the procedures in the factory service manual. Or perhaps just didn’t have time to complete the full procedure? Typically whenever you have a CEL the best course of action is to follow the troubleshooting procedures laid out in the factory service manual.

Also, the correct spark plug gap is 1.0-1.1mm. 1.3mm is the service limit. The factor service manual states: “Make sure that the 1.3mm plug gauge does not o into he gap for the platinum tip plug. If the gauge goes into the gap, do not attempt to adjust the side electrode; replace plug with a new one.”

Sounds like you already bought platinum plugs but in general I recommend sticking with copper. The only real benefit to platinum is that they can last longer. IMO they aren’t worth the price and I prefer to use standard NGK coppers and just replace them more often.[/QUOTE]

It’s a Honda shop that I’ve gone to for over a decade, but the DA guru who used to work on my car moved back to Canada. This guy is new.

So since he doesn’t seem to have a FSM, do you have any other suggestions on what to do next?

Also, is the B17 not different from the B18 as far as the gap? Am I reading this incorrectly?

Any Honda shop should have the FSM… I would still suggest the procedure in the FSM before trying anything else. Sounds like he tried some of what needed to be tested (like the vacuum lines and a new MAP sensor) but perhaps some of the other items were not checked - such as wiring, outputs from the sensor, ECU…etc. Shoot me an email, I can send you something that may help.

As for the plug gap… that’s strange because he FSM has much more detailed info about the spark plug gaps than what’s on your underhood sticker. I’ve always gapped mine to 1.1mm. Regardless, I wouldn’t expect this to be what’s causing your problem.

Email sent. Thanks!

Also, the first morning-start after the fuel filter replacement was normal. I think that problem has been resolved. Fingers crossed.

an update as to what you find would be most beneficial to other members :bow:

Absolutely. I hate when I’m looking for an answer and a potentially helpful thread just fizzles out.

It looks like it might be a short somewhere. I haven’t started the diagnosis, but I will update this when I figure it out.

Solved

So genius me…apparently not very good at reading codes.

This wasn’t code 5. This was code 41. O2 sensor. Fixed.

Thanks for everyone’s help though!