That sob is tough…someone tell me they’ve taken one out and how they went about doing it. it seems like theres vent ducting, and wires all infront of it, not to mention its way up on the clutch pedal.
heres my situation: my car will only push start. ive switched mfr, starter rly, can boost the starter from the + side of the battery. i hear all the clicks of the relays, ie fuel pump priming and the starter relay in the middle console. so i think its either the CIS or Ignition switch.
If you can hear the starter relay “click” the problem is not the CIS, to confirm this, turn the ign. switch to start then step on the clutch and release it, if you can hear the starter relay clicking on and off then the CIS is good, if you can not hear it, it still does not mean the switch is bad, it could be the ign. switch itself, [common problem on a G2].
If you do hear the starter relay click on and off as you step on and off the clutch peddle then it is a good bet it is the relay that is bad, [high current contacts] it also means the ign. switch is good, to test if it’s the relay you will need to get to the relay under the radio in center console.
Unplug the relay and use a jumper wire to connect the relays input and output together, black/white, [input from ign. switch] and black/red, [output to starter solenoid and “Engine Controls System”, [fuse 18], then try and start the car, jumping those two leads eliminates the relay and the CIS from the starter circuit, BE CARFUL car will start in gear.:whisper:94
When i turn key to start and not depress the clutch i can hear the starter relay behind the center console(vent area). when i push in the clutch and turn key to start i hear same relay, same area. no switching sound coming from the clutch peddle area.
this is kinda difficult for me to explain but ill try my best, this was intermittent at first. i would have the key turned to start and as soon as i would push the clutch it i could def. hear a different clicking noise…as i would keep the key turned to start and pump the clutch. a louder noise in regards to the starter relay. not anymore.
i went about some threads here regarding jumpering the CIS to eliminate it from the starting equation. i took blue/black and black and spliced what extra length of wire i could together. nothing changed, so i went back and resoldered it.
So in closing…how difficult is it to take out the CIS???, im just going to swap both out, the cis being the first. ive already seen where the starter relay is, not too difficult to reach. this is getting embarassing asking my friends and whatnot to help push start me. btw thanks for helping
Take a look at the clutch pedal where the clutch switch contacts the metal arm of the clutch pedal. there is supposed to be a plastic / rubber pad that pushes the CIS. the pad dry rots with time, and falls out. so when the pedal comes up, the “plunger” of the switch goes right into the hole where the pad is supposed to be, and doesn’t get pressed. I ended up putting a bolt with a washer and nut in the hole where the rubber pad was when I had the same problem.
The CIS is WAAAY up there. It is not easy to get to. That is why we trying to make sure there is not another problem. It would suck to go through all that trouble if you don’t have to.
I will do that tomorrow. i think i know of what your talking about. the brake pedal had one also. mines got a nut & bolt on that one. theres no room to work up there. the factory manual reads ‘remove dr. dash panel and knee bolster’ hahahaha thats it. can the clutch pedal be removed and be accessed abit more when free and open?
Not really, you’d have to remove the steering column in order to drop the whole pedal assembly (all three pedals).
If it is the rubber plug, you need to find a way to hold the pedal down, then reach up there to put the bolt / washer in.
Make sure whatever you use to hold the pedal doesn’t come off… Otherwise the pedal will snap forward catching your hand up there. (there WILL be lots of cursing… Trust me… but don’t ask me how I know. :argh: )
If I remember correctly, I pushed the pedal down, allowing me to stick the bolt / Washer in from the front, then I let the pedal go, so the plunger held the bolt in place, then reached up the back of the pedal to install the second washer and nut.
it seems odd that when i bypassed the switch altogether by splicing blue/black and black from the switch, it still wouldnt turn over? i may have done the splicing incorrectly. u remember what size bolt/nut combo used?
If I remember correctly, I just used a 7/16 (11mm) bolt about 1 inch long with a couple of washers I’m guessing anything 10mm-14mm should work. especially if you put some washers on it.
Also, if I remember correctly, there’s two switches on the clutch pedal. One is the interlock switch for the starter which is pressed when the clutch is pushed all the way down, and the other is to disengage the cruise control as soon as you step on the clutch. (plunger pressed when the clutch pedal is UP) . You might have jumpered the wrong one. Look closely.
Mine started the same way your’s is doing… I’d push the pedal and turn the key… sometimes it would work, sometimes nothing… I’d pump the pedal a few times and it would catch… until the pad fell off completely leaving a big hole for the switch plunger to go through.
I unplugged mine and threw it out. I’m not sure why that worked. On my CRX I spliced the wires together and threw it out. I’m not sure why that worked either. Both cars have had some janky alarm installs, so who knows.
I’m not even sure if that constitutes advice or just blithering. Good luck
The black, [CIS ground input] and the blue/black, [CIS output] are the correct leads, if you spliced them together and the car would still not start then the DIS is not the problem, [or not the only problem].
I would have a closer look at the starter relay, unplug the relay and install a jumper, [no need to cut and splice the leads].:squint:94
[QUOTE=fcm;1894872]The black, [CIS ground input] and the blue/black, [CIS output] are the correct leads, if you spliced them together and the car would still not start then the DIS is not the problem, [or not the only problem].
I would have a closer look at the starter relay, unplug the relay and install a jumper, [no need to cut and splice the leads].:squint:94[/QUOTE]
the plastic/rubber spikey bolt is still in the clutch pedal i can feel the pointed side. just to take the CIS out of the equation i am going to resplice the blue/black & blue leads to the CIS. FCM, i will jumper the starter relay leads?
The starter relay should have 4 leads in the plug …
1- Black/blue, ground supply from CIS to relays coil.
2- Black/white, [heavy gauge] input to relay from ign. switch.
3- Black/white, [light gauge] from ign. switch to relays coil.
4- Black/red, output from relay to starter solenoid.
Connect 2 and 4 together with a jumper, [same gauge].
Sorry, my mistake, the starter relay on a G2 is located on the right side of the heater unit.:bang:94
it could only be one of these things, correct me if i am wrong:
starter, starter solenoid, mfr, starter relay, CIS, ignition switch. am i missing anything?
i really do appreciate all the insight. if its not the starter relay, should i look into the ignition switch? regards
It will not be the starter solenoid, [or starter] if you can do a “bypass jump” to the solenoid, “can boost the starter from the + side of the battery” assuming that’s what you are doing, using a jumper from the batt. pos.(+) terminal to the starter solenoid.
It also can’t be the PGM-FI Main Relay, assuming that’s what you mean by “mfr”, the PGM-FI Main Relay has nothing to do with cranking the engine.
It’s not the CIS, [or not only the CIS], as you have bypassed it and still no crank.
That leaves the ign. switch or the starter relay.
The next step would be to bypass the starter relay.
A multimeter or 12V test light would make finding the problem a lot easier, if you do not have a meter, [or can’t borrow one, spend $20 at Radio Shack and get one, it has 101 uses for troubleshooting electrical problems in your car, it will pay for itself in no time.:whisper:94
well i checked all the things that could be wrong. after bypassing the CIS and starter relay. cleaned the contacts of the ig switch. then i went for the aftermarket POS alarm. it was a rats nest there. i really want to rip it out( prolly buy a trusted friend a 12 pack and do it). but my foot dislodged a connector, not allowing the full start. so i resoldered the cis, fought with the start relay, and zip tied alot of stuff to clean it up, and put it back together.
i now know more of the G2 starting system than i ever wanted to know. thanks to all those who helped esp. fcm
Just checking because i have the same problem right now. If the Blk/red wire coming from the starter relay is going to the starter from the CIS>starter relay, wouldnt this wire show voltage if the relay and switch is both working with the clutch pressed all the way in and the key on? I dont wanna start cutting and jumping wires if i can simply test this one wire with the clutch pressed in to see if its putting voltage to the starter. The starter worked fine when jumping it with + on battery to the starter solenoid, so im troubleshooting it now.
I know this thread is really old, but its better to resurect this one with more info for future people with the same problem rather than start a new thread right? lol This ones already full of useful stuff, my has well make it more useful.
Yes, the black/red would show voltage if CIS and starer relay are good, [when clutch stepped on and ign. switch turned to start.
Start by checking to see if you have output from the ign. switch, the black/white should show voltage when ign. switch is turned to start.
If your G2 is a 93 it could have a “stock” security system with a starter cut relay so you should check if there is voltage at the starter relay, [black/white] if not, find the starter cut relay and replace it.
If there is voltage at the starter relay, [black/white] check for ground, [at starter relay] on the black/blue CIS lead, when clutch pedal stepped on, if it is good the relay should “click” when ign. switch is turned to start and clutch pedal stepped on, if it does “click” test for voltage on the black/red at starter relay, if no voltage, replace the starter relay. 94
