Originally posted by teg92
Ok, nobody said 18’s are illegal on corvettes. It was stated that porsche decided not to use them, and it is illegal to run 18’s on integras. And as for trusting GM, whether or not I like domestics or not, I’m trusting porsche or any european car manufacturer before I trust ANY domestic.
yeah… ones that make their cars out of fiberglass… 
:evil:
Originally posted by Chado
[B]This isn’t directed at anybody just a little useful info for people saying how car manufacturers dont put big wheels on high performance cars:
The ultimate in horsepower, handling and excitement, Corvette Z06 is designed and built to excel on the road and on the track. Its very heart pounds with a 405 hp 5.7 L V8 high output engine that’s harnessed with a specially designed six-speed manual close ratio transmission and complemented with a head-up driver information display. The supreme performance of the Z06 is completed by 18" rear and 17" front aluminum wheels with red brake calipers and ultra wide tires
Thats right off of GM’s website. If you dont like Domestic cars, dont bash them. I dont really care. Alot of my family works for GM and I prefer honda’s. However, the Corvette is still a nice car, I wouldn’t buy one, but I wouldn’t mind owning one.
18" on rear and 17" on front…and we are discussing 17’s and 18’s are we not? I dont think that GMCANADA (thats the site I got that from) can sell cars with illegal tire sizes?
That wouldn’t make much sense ;-0
Chado. [/B]
You completely missed the point, that car has a suspension engineered to withstand the forces that are associated with these wheels.
Originally posted by ibpimp2u
[B]hello all
i asked a question about rim size and what would be better or look good…
THATS IT…
thank you for turning this into a small world war.
sticking to the 17 [/B]
Attn Marc:
First of all, this isn’t a World War. This is a relatively peaceful discussion and a very informative one at that:)
Second, for Marc, I have been thinking about this thread quite a bit lately. I have a few specific questions for you.
If the “negative impact” on suspension/car components by plus wheel sizes were graphed, would it be linear? ie, if a car is designed to have a 14" wheel it would be graphed at X, 15" would get a X+1, 16" would get a X+2, etc, where the variable assigned is some relative measurment? Or would the stress caused by each plus size increase “exponentially.” I believe you posted that you recently bought a set of 16" Mugen wheels. I’m curious how much safer and/or stress will be dissapated w/ 16" inch wheels than 17" wheels? Are your 16" Mugens going to be your daily drivers or strictly racing wheels?
Also, I remember an article some time ago that some one posted (I believe it was Stephen, gsr01) where a test was conducted on the performance aspects of different sized wheels. The test car was a heavily modded Honda Civic Hatch and it was driven around an auto-x course by a handful of national class auto-x drivers. They tested 14" through 17" wheels. I believe the findings were that most aspects of “handling/cornering” on this course were improved w/ each larger sized wheel. Unfortunately I don’t have the article so this probably sounds pretty lame. I’m citing some source that I can’t even remember, lame:( But I’m curious if my vague recollection of this article/test sounds correct or if you agree. Obviously this aspect of the test I’m bringing up does not address acceleration, stopping, stress on the car, safety, etc.
Thanks,
Leif
archivethis
Originally posted by Josh
[B]
You completely missed the point, that car has a suspension engineered to withstand the forces that are associated with these wheels. [/B]
This actually reminds me of something.
This would be assuming you are using stock suspension correct? No aftermarket stiffer suspension?
This is like a guy DNA told me about who was selling his civic turbocharged b18c5 in it. 400whp…w/ stock brakes.
Now tell me. Common sense tells me that you should upgrade your brakes if your going to make car go faster.
Common sense also tells me that you are upgrading suspesnion if you are upgrading wheels to drive harder? If you are lowering car you might also have other aftermarket kits (camber kit anyone?)
Just a thought…I am hoping people dont just go around and make things go faster without being able to stop them. Or other things (that was a great example though eh? 
)
Lets not blow the big wheel thing out of proportion. There are likely many more of us, including myself driving around with plenty of safety or environmental issues. Bad tires, improperly inflated tires, poor alignments, worn suspension components, no catalytic converters… you name it from bad windshield wipers to non working defrosters to oil leaks… just about all of it can be avoided with a bit of proper maintenance, even the majority of problems associated with big wheels and tires. We all live busy lives, need to get places, some times in a hurry. Were all not rich, maintaining a car takes money and time, we make do where we can. Driving takes concentration and effort, we all get tired and fatigued or want to have fun going fast. All of us enjoy are cars, want them to look good and consider them out growths of are selves. I have the luxury of urban living, close to where I work and close to amenities. I don’t need to be at work every morning, I make my own hours, I am not forced to drive my car every day and usually ride my bicycle or the bus if I must get somewhere. Race it when I want to and generally have enough money to do what I want to it. So, yes maybe it is sometimes easier for me to say things I 've said on this board. I am sorry if I offend any one with some of my comments, you included YellowIntegra. Many people that know me personaly call me the “crazy man” that looses his cool too often and easily. Hey that’s me, we all have our problems, and I just get emotionally involved with issues, no damage intended. It’s a new year do what’s best for yourselves, your family, friends and those around you. Enjoy what your doing, life goes by to fast, make the most of it while you can and don’t worry about the things you can’t do much about. Find your on style, what works for you, it’s usually through trial and error that’s how life works and I have made my share of errors and will continue to.
I guess what I’m trying to say here is pay attention to your perspectives, express them on this board, in you’re your lives, that’s how we grow and change, what makes us all different. Thanks for being here, thanks for the opposition, thanks for the support, there is no right or wrong all the time. And having a place to talk, discuss, fight, argue about car things, the wife or girl friend would never understand, makes the New Year something to look forward to. Checker flags for every one and have a great New Year!!!
Hey Chado,
No one said it is illegal if the car is designed and built around it’s wheels and tires. Were discussing when you add them to a car they were not original or optional equipment on from the manufacture. Ther must be an echo in here, you guy type faster then old people!
Hey when I was at SEMA there were 27” inch wheels!
Hey leifintegra,
You wrote;
“If the “negative impact” on suspension/car components by plus wheel sizes were graphed, would it be linear? big snip”
I wish I had a proper answer to this question but I am not an suspension engineer. If you want my best guess it would be depend on the suspension component you were evaluating, some parts it would be linear and some it would be exponential.
On the wheels I don’t daily drive my car, it has not moved in two weeks and the battery has run down, dead twice in the last few months because it has not been driven. The wheels are intended to be my wet race event wheels and tires but I do drive on the street back and forth to events. Can’t afford a tow vehicle right now.
You wrote;
“Also, I remember an article some time ago that some one posted (I believe it was Stephen, gsr01) where a test was conducted on the performance aspects of different sized wheels. big snip”
The article appeared in Grassroots Motorsports, titled “Super Size”, Jan/Feb 1999 page 71. The article was up on there web site but they have taken it down. David Wallens was the author and was also the editor of the magazine at the time. Maybe he needed filler, I belive the real reason being because it was heavily flawed and I know the magazine caught much flack from performance enthuses. The tire sizes were off, the tire compounds were different, the wheels were different…was not an equal comparison.
David is still a writer for the magazine, often posts on club si’s board and the SCCA board. If there was a specific question you had about the article I have the issue and can try too answer it or you can message him here Grassroots Motorsports or likely on club si. I can scan it and send you a copy if you want it.
wow…settle down fellas…ibpimp2u just ask a simple question…should he go with 17’ or not…just give him the answer yes or no…I mean you guys that have 16’ or lower diameter wheels, just chill…samething to you guys that have 17’ or more diameter wheels too…just chill man, I live in LA, and here the bigger the wheel the better, but thats just for show only, cruising etc…not for racing…
Originally posted by SPOT
wow…settle down fellas…ibpimp2u just ask a simple question…should he go with 17’ or not…just give him the answer yes or no…I mean you guys that have 16’ or lower diameter wheels, just chill…samething to you guys that have 17’ or more diameter wheels too…just chill man, I live in LA, and here the bigger the wheel the better, but thats just for show only, cruising etc…not for racing…
YO YO SPOT… telling someone yes or no kind be an insult if you don’t provide
information to back up your opinion. ibpimp4u sounds like he is not interested in some in depth discussion regarding his question.[SIZE=4]BUT[/SIZE] some of us on this page are. It gets a little tiring to read little snippets of slang
hashed around like I am at some stupid MTV Awards rehearsal.
Basically, if you don’t care for the info then don’t ask such an opened ended question.
Interesting post…didn’t read it all, but I’m glad I’m sellin my 16s and getting 15s (after purchasing SAFC)
AMERIKAN…I’m sorry about the remarks, is just that I was mad at my cable and my phone company…I just have fume out…sorry again.
im confused… i read all the text and my eyes hurt…
id say go for big looking 16’s with 205/45 series tires…
13’s and 16’s
stock
15’s
16’s
17’s
i need not to state the pros and cons of wheel sizes… here you can take a look for yourself…
Originally posted by DB2-R81
[B]Hey WaynesNside,
You wrote;
“My overall diameter is just a lil higher than my stock 14s I can take a pics and post it if need be. So what I have is just a larger contach patch touching the ground.”
Just to correct you one more time a larger tire does not give you a larger contact patch. It only changes the shape of the contact patch. If your tire is wider it gives you a wider, but narrower contact patch but the surface area stays the same.
[/b]
i have always been curious about this… we had a discussion in physics one day and couldn’t really totally justify it… ok… friction is the normal force (weight or mg if not on an incline) times the frictional constant (i dont feel like hunting through the character map for greek letters :)) so if you put on slicks which have more rubber touching the pavement compared to street tires with groves… how does it create more grip… also how does a wider tire not have more contact area than a skinnier tire? if they are both inflated respectable amounts wouldn’t they both have the same and then the extra width made the difference?
my best guess, for the first question. would be that the frictional coefficient would increase… and just to add my thought about the present argument… i agree with what you’re saying… but maybe it is a little bit exaggerated… i’m not sure about any of this, they’re just my thoughts, i’m no expert on antyhing 
anyway… i’m thinking the porsches were tested under very extreme conditions and i’m not sure about the audis… maybe they just had problems… i dunno… but if 18+ rims were such a BIG problem i would think we’d hear more stories about it… most people in here are fairly knowledgeable if not more and have read around on numerous forums… and no one has said anything about problems that you’re speaking of… i totally agree with you… that the tests prove that 18’s create more stress on the car… but i dont know if i agree that its such as a big deal that you’re making it out to be… i’m not trying to prove anyone wrong or anything… i’m just curious as i’m sure a lot of people are but are afraid to post becasue they dont want to get flamed… i’m just curious… anyone know about the slicks vs. street tires and friction differences?
oh yeah… amerikan. i’ll give you $50 for those rims and tires 
damn that was informative…
all I know is there is a lot of sidewall flex in my winter 14s and I miss my 17’s for hard cornering.
I have ST rear sway bar, illuminas, gc coilovers, front and rear tower bars and lower tie bar, and front and rear ingalls camber kits.
the best point made was that only about 1% of people in the “import scene” actually auto x which is why so many people run plus size wheels. It simply looks good.
marc you are crazy! 
Hey Narundomestics,
You guys are turning me into a physics instructor! I will try and answer but what exactly you want to know is not very clear in your questions.
It does not mater what diameter, width, or style tire is on a car, “rubber on the road or contact patch" will remain identical providing the weight of the car and the air pressure in the tire are the same. Archimedes Law stated that a floating body would immerse itself in a liquid until it displaces a volume of water equal to its own weight. There is a corollary here, the tire contact patches will continue to enlarge as the vehicle sinks down, until the contact patches are large enough so the internal pressure against the patches equals the weight of the vehicle. This is because of the air pressure in the tire pressing down against the patch, is the equal and opposite reaction of the air pressure at the top of the tire, Newton’s Law is holding up the car.
A vehicle will sink down until the force pushing up in the top of the tire, which is no longer balanced by the pressure in the bottom of the tire, because the pavement is taking the pressure through the tread, is equal to the vehicle weight. It makes no difference if the tires are wide, narrow, large in diameter or small, high or low profile, the tire contact patch size, in square inches will be the same for any given vehicle weight and tire pressure.
Why wide tires then?
You might recall a demonstration in physics class where a brick is pulled along a board attached to a string and a fish scale. It made no difference if the brick was on its wide side, narrow side or standing on end, the amount of force to pull the brick was the same. The explanation given was the coefficient of dynamic friction of the board and the brick remains the same. The brick remained the same weight, on end more weight per square inch, on its side less weight per square inch but more square inches. As the weight per square inch varied proportionately, there was no change in friction so long as the surfaces were constant.
Yes, this seems to contrdict the effects of wider tires?
There are some other considerations that play into it with tires though.
Tire compound, usually performance tires are softer and a softer tire will allow the rubber to conform to the road better, providing a higher coefficient of dynamic friction. .
Tire “A "on the left has 18 square inches of contact patch , tire “B” on the right has 18 square inches of contact patch.
It would take an awful lot of writing to discribe all the variables, so I will try giving some quick examples of other factors which demonstrate why a perfomance difference between a wide and a narrow tire.
Tire “A” hits a 4-inch wide hole, its adhesion or traction will be momentarily lost, while tire “B” still has 4 inches of contact patch left on the road, and more friction available to move the car foward.
Tire “A” hits a 4-inch bump it will be completely affected while only half of tire “B” will and it is more likely to absorb the bump then bounce off it, more friction.
Tire “A” in an emergency stop or under hard acceleration has the same rubber in contact with the road twice as long as tire “B”, resulting in a greater amount of heated rubber compound and less friction.
A narrow tire must have high sidewalls in order to have a large contact patch or the rim will have insufficient clearance above the road. High sidewalls generate more sidewall flex and cornering distortion, more heat less friction.
Tire “B” has 18 square inches of contact patch with far less side wall flex, thus less heat build up and more friction.
I hope this answers most of your questions if not, let me know and I will try and explain it in another way.
Dam, i can’t believe i read all three pages on this thread!!! Somebody give my some money so I can buy myself a life!! [SIZE=3]HAHAHAHAH!![/SIZE]
anyways, very interesting info & opinions…
and to think, i came here looking for pics of rims on a G2 teg… now i got enough info to write my dam physics paper!! hahah… I LOVE THIS BOARD!!
anyways, there WAS something i wanted to post reply to…
anyway… i’m thinking the porsches were tested under very extreme conditions and i’m not sure about the audis… maybe they just had problems…
don’t know if this matters or if anyone cares, but for those interested, here’s a couple of interesting facts about “testing” porsches:
In May 1993 a 928 GTS broke the world record for the most distance covered in 24 hours. It travelled 3,960 miles at an average speed of 165 mph at Nardo, Southern Italy (including fuel and driver stops). This speed is substantially higher than the best averages in the 24 hours of Le Mans.
In 1995 the latest 911 Carrera 4 entered the Guinness Book of Records when it completed the “toughest 100,000 km endurance test ever for a sports car”, which included a 24 hour test in the Arctic Circle at -35"C and a 2000 km high speed run at over 250 km/h.
Also, for the water-cooled 911’s, Porsche runs the car through the Australian outback, in 100 degree weather, for several hours straight with the A/C on full blast to past endurance tests…
don’t know what “tests” Honda does for its cars… just thought this was interesting…
go for 16’s
:LOL:
15’s are good.