Okay, we’ve all seen this post at one time or another. Now I’m on the receiving for information, and I would appreciate all of your help. I’m set on H&R sport springs and Koni yellows. I’m told this is a very formidable combo with great quality to boot. Now comes my dilemma. Bars. I want F/R strut bars (Thinking Neuspeed) And F/R sway bars (Thinking Suspension Techniques). I also want a radius arm, but don’t know anyone else but Z10 who makes these for the G2 Integras. Let me know if you have any suggestions or concerns. Just FYI, I’m an avid downhill racer in my local area, competetion consists mainly of EG and EK civics, AE86s, S14s and the occasional VW GTI and GTR skylines (no sh!t here…the Skylines run on a few of my local roads.) Feel free to get technical, I speak geek too. As you read ladies and gentleman, with my suspesnion, it’s gotta be Heaven or Bust!
Perhaps if you were a little more specific with your question, we could help you a little more. What do you want, and expect the end result to be? Have you researched all the parts you want to buy(not only for their quality, which is also very important, but also, how they will affect your car’s handling)? It is pretty easy to buy a bunch of name brand parts, and put them on your car. This is probably fine for most drivers who really don’t know how to push their car to the limit. If you don’t like understeer, you might want to think about how much you stiffen up the front relative to the rear. Also, most lowering springs are still designed to promote understeer. The easiest way to fix this, is to specify you spring rates and get either a coilover sleeve, or a true coilover(if you are just starting out, I would suggest a coilover sleeve). Again, ask some more specific questions, and you should find that there are a few people here that would be glad to help.
Originally posted by GSR01
Also, most lowering springs are still designed to promote understeer.
And the h&r sports are notorious for this. I know because I have them along with koni yellows and front and rear ST sway bars. I haven’t raced with the yellows yet and I’m hoping they will get rid of the massive understeer the h&r sports gave me when I was on stock shocks. If they don’t then I’m swapping out the springs for something stiffer. I may do that down the road anyway. But it sounds like you know what you’re talking about so let us know what you come up with and what works best for you.
Speaking of racing, it’s on for Saturday. I talked to Jordan, and he said he doesn’t have to work so he should be coming too, although he will most likely be riding with me instead of driving.
GSR01: could you give me a brief description of your car? I live in Lawrenceville and I am wondering if I have ever seen your car around.
It’s a mostly stock aztec green GS-R lowered about an inch and a half with stock wheels and Texas plates, normally parked on the Georgia Tech campus. I haven’t been up in the Gwinnett area in a while. Over the summer, I co-oped just off of Sugarloaf at a place called WIKA. I will be there again in the spring.
H&R bad springs?
Well, I actually looked into Skunk2 coilover sleeves but dismissed it. Should I have given it another look? Yes, Understeer is a bitch and I’m looking to remedy this…I assumed H&R’s were up there when it came to handling. I also realize that understeer is eminent since the DA and DB are FF. So, if not H&Rs, then what would you suggest? Eibach? Progress? What would be a good street/track spring that is comfortable (somewhat) yet responsive and stable under road going conditions? I actually don’t know about the spring rate I should be looking for but as far as quality, I’m aware that H&R are up there with the best.
One more thing.
Please don’t tell me Ground control Coilovers. My buddy had them in an EG6 and they weren’t nadda when he swapped in the H&Rs. This is a big reason I decided on these springs in the first place. Also, correct me if I’m wrong WhiteyG2RS, but won’t using stiffer springs on stock shocks be detrimental to improving a car’s handling?
The only coilover sleeve I have experience with is the Ground Control/Eibach combo. I chose them simply because they allowed me to specify the spring rates I wanted and still offered a quality product. Most of the people on this board who have done research into a setup are running anywhere from around 350 to 600lb/in front and around 450 to 900lb/in rear, with the larger rate always in the rear. Also, if you choose to upgrade your front sway bar, you might want to consider going up even more in the rear, to 22mm. There are plenty of threads on this topic, so I’m sure you can find the answer you are looking for if you do a search. Personally, I have to compromise between crappy Atlanta roads, and performance, so I went with Ground Control sleeves w/ Eibach ERS 380f 450r on Koni Yellows. I also have a ST 19mm rear sway bar in the mail(I am leaving the front stock). So far, I am happy with it. I ended up setting my ride height at about 1.5 inches lower than stock, so I can still clear speed bumps and most driveways etc…, and I don’t have to worry as much about bottoming out my shocks. I also have access to a full shop with cornerweight scales, so that helped as well.
I used to think the h&r sports were good springs too and I couldn’t understand why I couldn’t drive my car in autocrosses. I kept plowing into cones in corners. But then I started looking at spring rates. The h&r sports have spring rates of 340/186 (f/r). Take a look at a much better setup like Stephen’s above. He’s got 380/450. See how the front springs are softer? That would reduce understeer. There aren’t any springs I know of that you can just purchase direct from a company for the gen2 that will have a lower spring rate in the front. You have to go custom like Stephen did. But, there are springs that are much better than the h&r sports. For example there are the neuspeed sports, 340/230, and even better would be the neuspeed race, 500/450. At least the spring rates of these springs are closer together and it would take less additional modifying to stiffen up the rear like firming up your shocks.
Oh and do a search for ‘spring rates’ and there should be a link somewhere to a chart that has all the popular spring rates of springs made for the gen2. That’s where I’m getting all my info from.
FYI, I could get the rear of my car to come around with Neuspeed Race springs (500F/450R) on stock shocks with 47F/35R tire pressures.
I’m in negotiations right now for Koni Yellows and Ground-Control with 450F/400R, and I’ll be purchasing 600R springs to replace the 400’s.
Sway bars will have to stay stock for now until I see how money situation is post-purchase.
GREAT info guys
Many thanks fellas. But now I’m a bit confused?? So, basically you guys are saying that it’s better for FWD cars like ours to obtain springs that are stiffer in the rear rather than the front or springs that have similar rates for cornering weight transfer. This setup would help neutralize understeer and behave more balanced. Is this what you guys are stating? Please get back to me asap. I’m looking to pruchase springs by the end of this week. Keep in mind that these will be paired with Koni yellows.
Re: One more thing.
Originally posted by TougeDB1
Please don’t tell me Ground control Coilovers. My buddy had them in an EG6 and they weren’t nadda when he swapped in the H&Rs. This is a big reason I decided on these springs in the first place.
Please explain this statement. I don’t really understand what you are trying to say.
As for the rates, most people have found that it helps to prevent understeer if they bias the rear stiffer than the front.
As for load transfer, it is not a function of spring rates. It is a function of acceleration, weight, cg height, and wheelbase or track. You can’t just assume that similar rates would produce a desired result, since you also have to take into account the vehicle’s weight distribution,and the motion ratios in the front and rear. Yes, load transfer should be considered when choosing spring rates. However, it is something that should be calculated before, and a choice should be made with respect to it(motion ratios included). This would be more important in a race only car. In your application, it is not important that you do this calculation(although it would be relatively simple if I knew the cg height). The rates I stated in my previous post should produce close to your desired result. If you have any further questons, I would call up the guys at a place like Ground Control or Eibach and get their advice on the issue.
mojo- I could get my car to come around on stock suspension. You just have to know how to push a car’s buttons 
Re: Re: One more thing.
mojo- I could get my car to come around on stock suspension. You just have to know how to push a car’s buttons
Hehe, my car wasn’t stock long enough for it to do much of anything. Springs went on right after I bought the car and if I had it to do over again I would have kept it stock for a while, bought some sticky tires and learned how to drive a slow car fast. :roll:
Anyhow, be careful the spring rates on a daily driver…particularly if you see snow. I’m speaking for GSR01 too and hopefully correctly, but sometimes our heads are just a little bit race-oriented and we forget that a lot of people don’t necessarily care that much.
Understeer is a good thing because it makes a car predictable under throttle, while lifting the throttle, and trailbraking. Oversteer is a good thing because it helps the car to “rotate” around a turn, and you can really manipulate the car more as a driver. Oversteer can be fun…so long as it doesn’t catch you by surprise.
Running higher rear spring rates (e.g. 400F/600R) will be more likely to induce oversteer, particularly under lift-throttle situations and trail-braking (braking while turning, typically at the limit of adhesion). For a street car this isn’t necessarily the safest thing, and if a driver’s skill doesn’t match his/her suspension set-up, one can get oneself in a hairy situation in no time.
Read around for a while before making a decision, and if you must have a suspension now, I would advise going on the conservative side (running higher front rates, than rears (e.g. 400F/300R or something somewhat similar). If you go with a Ground-Control set-up you can always order new pairs of springs to play around with the rates.
Re: Re: One more thing.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by GSR01
[B]Please explain this statement. I don’t really understand what you are trying to say.
What I mean is that in my opinion from driving his car, I could really feel a better ride quality and cornering felt much nicer.
Well, so far guys, I kinda like the Neuspeed race springs now too. They have an almost balanced rate of 500/front 450/rear compared to H&R sport which has something like 486 front and 295 rear. Not to mention that I have a 4dr. Not exactly lightweight so would’nt stiffer springs be better?