Which oil should I use now?

INFORMATION G2IC Archives
1

Well I’m almost done with my engine and now I’m thinking that I should either use synthetic or reg oil. I was opting for the synthetic, but is it really worth it? I read some of the post about the oils, but no one has said really much about if there is a significant advantage of using synthetic for our engines. Right now I use pretty much whatever is on sale (Valvoline and Castrol) but amd thinking about using Mobile 1 strictly.

What do you all think I should start using now on my new motor build?

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depends. all new seals? rings maybe? driving hard? gonna rev high? want to wait longer between oil changes? want the best additives and protection, yet run a lower weight for that slight power advantage? go get some super syn then

3

Everything on this engine is brand new except external things. I will be driving it hard, will be autocrossing, redline quite frequently, and change my oil every 3K miles religiously. I was going to use mobile 1 becuase I seen some dyno runs using it and it showed a 1-3 hp advantage. But that was the regular mobile 1 oil, not the synthetic kind.

Do you recommend the mobile 1 synthetic kind? Some post said it was crap and burns?

4

rcnacura: have you read that 17 page long post about mobil 1 super syn on honda-tech? I was confused as to what to use after i read that but after a few comforting words from other members, i went ahead and used it. Prior to this i was using the mobil 1 tri syn formula and it was fine. With the super syn, my oil level went down slightly on the dipstick for the 1st time after a while. Am not blaming this on the oil or anything but it’s kinda strange that it happend now whem i started using the new formula mobil 1 oil. I’ll use it again the next oil change and see what happens. BTW my engine has about 20k miles now (2000 b20z).

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I didn’t read all of the 17 page long posts, but I read the first few pages, and stopped becuase it kept going back n forth with answers.

So you are using the mobile formula 1 oil? Out of all of them, which do u think was better? Doesn’t seem like the super tri syn works that well since it dissappears (according to other post too) after awhile.

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Amsoil 3000 series . you can go 20k on it if you change the filters.

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Originally posted by rcnacura
But that was the regular mobile 1 oil, not the synthetic kind.
Mobil 1 is synthetic, the non-synthetic is just plain old Mobil. I’m using Mobil 10W-30 for the first 1500 miles, changing it at 500 and then again at 1500. At which time I’m going to start using Mobil 1 Tri-syn 5W-30. Don’t even consider using syn. for break-in.

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rcnacura,

Only an oil analysis will answer your question. If you are VERY serious about protecting your engine, I suggest you run some trend analysis. Synthetics are by far more superior than dino oil. However, be very careful reading up on company labels and such. As for off-the-shelf products, I can only vouch for Mobil 1 being 100% synthetic. Others such as Castrol Syntec, Pennzoil w/ Pennzane, & Quaker State Synthetic are only Group III dino oil that has gone through a severe hydrocracking process.

Don’t get me wrong. Group III severely hydrocracked oils have gone a long way, and some actually do perform just as well as other 100% synthetics. However, the costs per litre to the consumer is quite staggering, and hence my recommendation of a good Synthetic once you reach that high $/litre range.

You can’t go wrong with using Mobil’s Tri-Syn. or their new formula SuperSyn. These are excellent oils, but not necessarily the best, IMHO. Others such as AMSOIL, Redline, Schaeffers, Chevron, & Petro Canada are also good choices.

As for the weight - I’m assuming you live in a very warm climate all-year round. If that is the case, I suggest sticking with 10W30. Don’t think for even a second that this weight is any thicker than 5W30 - IT IS NOT. However, 10W30 is much more stable because 1) less need of Viscosity Index Improvers because it is relying on its inherent Viscosity Index & 2) Evaporation percentage rate is lower.

Having the need for less VI improvers means that the 10W30 can stay within the 30wt. longer. Having the oil evaporate less means less oil burning - less oil consumption.

Again, oil analysis is very important here. DO NOT RELY on pure advertising alone!! Just because AMSOIL advertises that their oil can go 25000miles (or whatever) doesn’t mean that you should do the same.

With oil analysis, you can determine:

  • It’s viscosity. People do not realize that oils can thin out or thicken depending on engine condition or length of use. So be very careful once that 10W30 starts flowing like a 20wt.!
  • Oxidation levels. How much of the oil has been exposed to oxygen - hence limiting its ability to lubricate and protect.
  • Wear metal count. Need I say more?
  • Dirt count. VERY BIG FACTOR in determining engine life. High amounts of dirt can be abrasive and scuff the metals down like sandpaper.

If you need more info, feel free to email me.

Regards,

Oz

9

Originally posted by jonsteR
rcnacura: have you read that 17 page long post about mobil 1 super syn on honda-tech? I was confused as to what to use after i read that but after a few comforting words from other members, i went ahead and used it. Prior to this i was using the mobil 1 tri syn formula and it was fine. With the super syn, my oil level went down slightly on the dipstick for the 1st time after a while. Am not blaming this on the oil or anything but it’s kinda strange that it happend now whem i started using the new formula mobil 1 oil. I’ll use it again the next oil change and see what happens. BTW my engine has about 20k miles now (2000 b20z).

ditto. i just went ahead and used it after others took the plunge too. we’ll see what happens but so far so good.

what is this about supersyn burning up unusually? id like to hear some conditions… i guess i can live with burning up a quart every 4-6months but lately ive been taking it very easy so im not that worried.

10

Originally posted by rcnacura
I will be driving it hard, will be autocrossing, redline quite frequently, and change my oil every 3K miles religiously. I was going to use mobile 1 becuase I seen some dyno runs using it and it showed a 1-3 hp advantage. But that was the regular mobile 1 oil, not the synthetic kind.

rcnacura,

I missed on commenting about this. When racing, I personally do not recommend 10W30 or any 30wt. oils or lower. I suggest using 15W40 or 15W50. Then switch back to 10W30 for street use (unless you also rev a lot, and do high speed driving on the streets - in which case I recommend 5W40 or 10W40).

The use of 40wt or 50wt oils during racing is to protect your engine. Unless you want to sacrifice that reliability factor and prefer that 1-2HP peak gain. If you are still adamant in using 30wt. oils, then I suggest using an oil with A LOT of anti-wear additives (lots of Zinc, Phosphor, and/or Moly). SuperSyn - although used by racing teams - does not carry any added extra additives (for the 30wt. and lower scale). In fact, SuperSyn with weights of: 0W30, 5W30, 10W30 have less Zinc and Phosphor in them to comply with API SL standards (in comparison to Mobil 1 Tri-Synth.). The only oils that I can think of that MAY qualify are AMSOIL and Redline (and possibly Motul).

Again, I’m looking at this at a reliability standpoint.

Regards,

Oz

11

Originally posted by XDEep
what is this about supersyn burning up unusually? id like to hear some conditions…

This is possible primarily due to the fact that the evaporation loss (or in somewhat technical terms: NOACK volatility) is a lot higher for the SuperSyn oils (30wt. and lower only).

You can all blame this to API SL certifications. Generally though, under normal driving conditions (light load, normal acceleration, no high RPM engagement), you shouldn’t experience this problem.

Out of all the 30wt. oils of SuperSyn, 10W30 has the lowest NOACK %.

Regards,

Oz

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oz…you had emailed me about the oils (jdbrocious@hotmail.com)…i went and bought mobil-1 supersyn 5w-30 but i havent put it in yet… the only other one they had was 10w-40, would that be better???

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Originally posted by chipper
oz…you had emailed me about the oils (jdbrocious@hotmail.com)…i went and bought mobil-1 supersyn 5w-30 but i havent put it in yet… the only other one they had was 10w-40, would that be better???

Chipper,

You haven’t replied back, you silly :wink: Anyway, SuperSyn is not available yet here in Canada - so I am not aware of other SuperSyn grades (such as 10W40). By all means, I would recommend that over 5W30 based on driving conditions that you have told me.

Based on your driving habits, I wouldn’t be surprised if the SuperSyn 5W30 shears down to 5W20!! The SuperSyn 0W30 will be even worse, and will shear down to 0W20 sooner. The 10W30 will hold out the longest - and is probably the better choice IF you want to stick to a 30wt. As for the 10W40 - if it does shear down - it will shear down to 10W30 and hold it there for quite a while.

As for the summer - and summer ONLY - you may run 15W40. The only 15W40 synthetic off the top of my head would be Delvac 1300S (different from Delvac 1).

Regards,

Oz

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thanks again…i gotta drive to school tomorrow so im goin to get the 10-40 in there instead…

15

i have a totally new motor (internally)… run quaker state 5w-30 regular oil. i drive hard daily, don’t have time to warm up the car… etc etc. basically i’m harsh on my motor. i change my oil every 3000 miles myself, oem filter everytime. oil comes out like it’s never been used! EXCEPT one time, just once i used a FRAM, and the oil came out a bit darker than usual… strange i’m not gonna use fram again.

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ARCHIVETHIS

oz - know anything about royal purple??? i know its expenssive as sh!t.

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oem=honda usdm filter is suck http://www.ntpog.org/reviews/filters/filters.shtml

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Eeck, Don’t use OEM filters. FRam is better than OEM by far, but Mobile and that other green colored oil filter is good too. I use fram oil filters, and they work just great for me.

Back to oil,

So I shouldn’t use the mobile 1 syn for my breakin period? Speaking of Redline, ues everyone rants about this product, but should I use redline for the breakin period (I’m going to break in the engine for the first 3K miles hopefully)? Or should I just use what I have now? The Castrol 10-30?

As for the wieghts, I usually use 10-30 and 10-40 because I buy by the case and forget sometimes which oil to use. Right now I have a 10-30 case, but b4 I used the 10-40. Should I use 10-40 always? Also as for the break in I was going to change the oil every 1000 miles. WEll 500, 1000, 1500. Is this a good choice?

I did want to start using solely the more expensive oils, but its just too expensive overtime. Can’t afford it on a daily basis.

Oh bTW, I have an oil cooler and a relocated oil filter using a larger filter if that will make more of a decision about the oils.

I’m quite hard on the engine too like integguy91. I usually don’t warm the car up becuase my dad (which is a mechanic) says that carbon buildup happens most then or just in general. I run the engine hard as mentioned before, and redline or stay in the 4-6500 rpm range at times. I go 80+ on the highway which makes the engine at 4K staedy. Also the engine will have alot of highway miles too if that helps.

thanks for all the replies! and yes Definately archivethis

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Originally posted by VTEC_Teggy

oz - know anything about royal purple??? i know its expenssive as sh!t.

Don’t bother archiving this. I was thinking of doing a writeup about choosing the right oil and then have everybody’s input on it.

VTEC_Teggy -> As for Royal Purple. At this time, there are mixed reviews about this oil. The “Street” oils are still being discussed as to whether it is 100% Group IV synthetic or Group III dino oil. The “race” oils are confirmed as Synthetics. A very reputable oil analyzing “scientist” has been getting good wear metal results when he analyzed some of his customers that were using Royal Purple. The engines were Honda 1.6L and 2.0L engines. Were they B-series, he does not know. He commented that the RP protected the engine just as well as other top synthetic brands. So, under the microscope, RP seems to work well.

However, “personal” experience from actual users have had weird engine anomalies after using this oil. Such as, heavy oil consumption and weird transaxle noises (when using their gear weight oils).

Also, their “advertised” numbers such as VI, Flashpoint, TBN, etc. are being questioned and debated. Also, their marketing strategy is also being questioned, as it seems to indicate that they are a snake-oil company. BTW, the purple colour of the oil is just a dye that disappears after a few hundred miles of driving.

IMHO, I would not recommend this oil as real-life info is very little. Also, the price per litre is quite high. At that range, I would recommend using something else. RP does use Moly as part of its anti-wear package along with Zinc and Phosphor. The Moly is in small concentration compared to Redline. This Moly additive blend may be the reason for reduced wear in the engines I mentioned. However, the mixing of the proper Moly additive along with the rest of the oil’s additives is quite difficult.

Regards,

Oz

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from crvtec.com

Use 0-30, or 5-30, or 10-30 motor oil and a Honda filter. Do NOT use synthetic motor oil for break in. Make sure the fluid levels are where they should be.

Start it up and keep the engine at 2500 -3000 rpm for about 20 minutes. Make sure there are no leaks, or mechanical problems. The only idling will be for setting the timing.

Before doing the schedule, remember that running the engine at steady rpm (like cruising on the freeway) is not good for break-in.

0-200 miles. Try to keep the highest rpm under 3000 rpm. Every 15-20 miles, zing the engine to 4500 rpm in first and occasionally in second gear.

200-400 miles. Try to keep the revs limited to 3500 rpm. Raise the “zing” rpm to 5500 with the same frequency as above.

400-600 miles. Go to 4000 rpm for driving limit. Raise the “zing” to 6000 - 6500 rpm and include 3rd gear pulls, same frequency.

600-800 miles. 4500 rpm driving limit. “Zing” it to 7000+ rpm and include partial 4th gear pulls.

800-1K miles. 5000 rpm limit with “zing” to 7500+ with some pulls all the way through 4th and partial fifth gear pulls.

Now, don’t misunderstand me on the zings. You don’t HAVE to scream the engine religeously at the prescribed intervals. If you don’t have the space to run the engine up in the selected gears, don’t do it. Just know that you can, and IF the opportunity comes around lay into it. Don’t over-do the procedure.

I recommend that the oil be changed at the 1K mile marker. If the plugs are looking good and if the compression’s (and leak down numbers) good, switch to Mobil 1 for life. Use either 0-30, or 10-30. After the oil change, you might want to reset the valves and from that point on, drive it the way you’d normally run it.