wow very nice man:). im jealous. my project is taking me forever
No more input? Hmm.
Haha, not on here too much. Regarding input, I think you are doing a fantastic job! Your teg is one of my inspirations, says alot xD! Love the color, and everything that you have done with her. Makes me wish I could paint, or wonder if you are taking side jobs. ANyways, keep it up, and find your way up to Colorado during the summer for one of our G2 get togethers!
Hah I’m always taking side jobs… My brother actually owns a body/paint shop down here so, we’re always painting cars. I’d actually enjoy heading up to CO man, it seems like you guys have a nice little (or big? lol) G2 community out there.
Thanks for the positive feedback, even though I had to phish for it!
A few more pics… Its still not fully assembled, but enough to get my emissions done, which I PASSED! w00t!
There’s still masking tape on the grill & front/rear bumper molding… As I said, a work in progress 
Sorry for the low quality cellphone pics… As I said, once its together and up to snuff I’ll get some decent pictures of it.
^^^ looking good
[QUOTE=unified112;2180570]Hah I’m always taking side jobs… My brother actually owns a body/paint shop down here so, we’re always painting cars. I’d actually enjoy heading up to CO man, it seems like you guys have a nice little (or big? lol) G2 community out there.
Thanks for the positive feedback, even though I had to phish for it![/QUOTE]
We try 
love this build man, even thought I waited till page four to post:)
LOL^
No worries man. Feels good to get some love from the CO guys, you folks have some mean builds going on. :surrend:
car looks really good man…keep up the good work…love the color too !
[QUOTE=unified112;2180587]
Sorry for the low quality cellphone pics… As I said, once its together and up to snuff I’ll get some decent pictures of it.[/QUOTE]
^^Ok, it’s been almost two months, I’m gonna go ahead and call bullshit on this one. Surely you have taken that tape off and put on the rear views and pass side door handle by now!
Just messing with you. I’ve, um. been planning. Yeah, that’s it. That is why my build hasn’t moved forward in months. I just resurfaced a few days ago and this is the first I’ve seen a lot of these pictures; your car looks fantastic. I like the height, the wheels look good, the color is of course choice. Um. but why haven’t you taken off the rear windshield wiper? If you drive fast enough, the rain doesn’t even touch that window!
I saw the bare block in one of the earlier posts. Did you do the assembly yourself?
[QUOTE=buymysoul;2187994]^^Ok, it’s been almost two months, I’m gonna go ahead and call bullshit on this one. Surely you have taken that tape off and put on the rear views and pass side door handle by now!
Just messing with you. I’ve, um. been planning. Yeah, that’s it. That is why my build hasn’t moved forward in months. I just resurfaced a few days ago and this is the first I’ve seen a lot of these pictures; your car looks fantastic. I like the height, the wheels look good, the color is of course choice. Um. but why haven’t you taken off the rear windshield wiper? If you drive fast enough, the rain doesn’t even touch that window!
I saw the bare block in one of the earlier posts. Did you do the assembly yourself?[/QUOTE]
^hahaha
Actually, the car does still have masking tape on the bumpers
Its actually in storage right now for the winter, I refuse to drive this car in the winter. Thanks for all of the compliments though! Im actually wanting it lower than it currently is, wheel gap is a bit outa control imo. As far as the rear wiper, lol, I dunno… Just havent really had the urge to take it off & find the metal OEM plug for it. Thats on my To-Do list, maybe it’ll be done this summer.
I didn’t build the motor myself… I got a steal of a deal on assembly, so I just paid to have it done. As soon as spring is here I will finish assembling the car & get it tuned… Until then I am just happy to know that it is 95% finished!
Speaking of your build… Have you come to any decisions on what you’re running? I havent checked your thread in quite a while… UPDATES man!!
Oh. Haha. I bet you took out the heat, didn’t you? Cool, cool, I’ll check back in the spring. You know this Texas boy hasn’t been doing any work on his car since the temperature dropped below 40 up here.
Here is the link to the plug you need and here is a write up on how to install it. Maybe Santa or Kwanzaa-bot will bring a plug to you…
Seriously though, that has to feel pretty damn good to get the car to where it is right now. Do you have a set of thin side moldings that you are going to paint and put on it?
I have decided to stay OEM (parts) on my build (with some exceptions). I’m going to do JDM P73 pistons instead of P30 (I updated my thread recently with my thoughts on that) and stick with CTR cams and stock (ITR) valve train. I am also considering trying my hand at the final engine assembly. As far as actual work, I am 97% done pulling out the damn ABS wiring and I’ve got the suspension off and ready to install bushings. Block is ready to go to the machine shop…I just need to actually take it there.
Nah I left the heater in… in retrospect I suppose I could have pulled it out, but id rather not have to pull the dash lol. I’m keeping the USDM moldings, but am going to give them a fresh coat of black aerosol trim-paint. Either the DupliColor stuff or the SEM, I’m not sure yet. But yeah, once it got cold & rainy here I tucked the car away.
Hey now… I’m the Skunk2 fanboy, don’t give Colin my credit. Seriously though, I don’t mind other cams one bit, as long as they’re a proven cam and can put down some good numbers. That being said, my main nit-pick is people who don’t match their spring to their cam. Such as B16 users who upgrade to R cams yet use B16 springs. I mean yeah, it may be safe at the stock b16 redline… but I personally wouldn’t trust it. The same goes for Jun/Toda/S2/Rocket etc cams with stock B16/Type-R springs.
That being said, I can honestly say that I wish I would have gone a little more aggressive with my cam selection. I already had the R valvetrain, so due to my aforementioned nit-pick, I got R cams to go with it. I know I’ve only driven my car 40miles since the build, and its only running on a basemap (a good one, though), but I wish the bottom end felt a bit stronger. After being tuned I may be singing a different song though.
Heh. I actually edited out my comment about the JUN cams (although you obviously saw it in the email notification) because I realized that when I was looking on their website last night that 1. The specs on their site may not be @1mm and 2. I was looking at the lift for the VTEC lobes but the duration of the primary? lobes so my comment about high lift and short duration wasn’t actually true and they stopped to be interesting to me. You and Colin are in a little 3-way love fest with Skunk2, don’t try to let him off the hook. Actually, I’m giving him shit because on my thread I mentioned some Spoon cams off hand and he immediately started showing the Skunk2 love. Honestly though, looking at what is actually available new off the shelf, for practical use, I don’t see any other viable cam manufacturer that I would want to use these days. Skunk2 stole the Toda B profile for sure, but they have been continually refining (sometimes for better than other times) it the last several years. Last I heard, there was still a lot of rumors about the Toda Bs just thrashing valve trains.
What I don’t get about the valve spring thing is why people think the springs will be ok “if you don’t rev too high”. Uh. WTF? If your cams have a higher lift than the bind point of the springs you are using, you are going to have issues no matter what and valve float is the least of your worries at that point. That’s one reason why I want to do the ITR intake springs on both the intake and exhaust side of my build: 1. In 97 and 98 the ITR used the same valve springs on both sides (blue) so I know that using the same springs on both sides is going to be OK. 2. If I choose to go with a stage 1 aftermarket cam at some point in the future, chances are that in addition to the lobe on the Intake side being a little bigger, the one on the exhaust side (based on looking at specs of what is and has been available) is going to have a MUCH bigger lobe than the stock cam with the blue springs. Now, since they used those same springs on the 97 and 98 intake, you know that the bind point is probably going to be ok, but I’ll take all the extra assurance I can take, thank you. Obviously an argument against doing the yellows on the EX side is an argument that Honda may have lessened the spring pressure because of the lighter valves, but (and I can’t find where I saw this originally) my suspicion is that the bind point on these springs is actually higher than the blues. If you look at measurements done years ago on the blue springs, the max lift on them is 11.5mm with the bind point being 11.7mm. That doesn’t give you a whole hell of a lot of leeway and I wouldn’t be surprised if Honda got concerned about long term valve train wear from habitual over-revving…but I ain’t know mechanical engineer, so what do I know?
But yeah, with that 11.6:1 compression you are running, I imagine things would have been pretty happy with a stage 2 cam (or something like the Pro1) but just run it as is for now, you will feel a ton better about it after you get it tuned. Your guy just gave you something so you won’t blow it up while breaking it in, but it is probably the equivalent of the map honda uses when you have an engine code. I wouldn’t sweat it just yet. You know how a 3rd gen GSR felt the first time you drove it? It is AT LEAST going to feel that good once it is tuned properly. Although you’re brother has some kind of Honda with wicked b-series love doesn’t he? so maybe your baseline is in a different place than mine.
Its good to see that you’re on the right track as far as camshaft/spring matching goes. That’s one of my pet peeves. I really haven’t seen many numbers or dynos on Spoon stuff, though I DO have a dyno chart of a SpoonR. (B18c5 with Spoon pistons/cams/head-package) that pulled only like 3whp more than a stock B18c5. I’ll have to see if I can dig through my pc and find it for you.
I would definitely trust a Spoon product as far as durability/reliability, but I think there are companies out there that can get the performance-edge above most Spoon stuff.
Yeah my brother has a sick set-up… a pretty aggressive P&P on the head with a full S2 headpackage (Pro1 cams, titanium springs/retainters, flat faced valves) and some sick JE pistons. He’s sitting at about 11.1:1 on his 81.5mm B16 with 197whp/115wtq. so comparing my top end to his is quite unfair, but it leaves me ‘wanting’ lol. When my guy burned my map he said its basically a stock Type-R map “with a bit of timing pulled at the top end to ensure no detonation”. Once its dialed in I’m sure I will be tons more happy.
Colin makes a valid arguement, Skunk2 seem to always be doing more R&D and constantly revising their products, which is usually a good thing… my issue is that they have so many ‘stages’ and re-designed products that it is hard to keep them straight or classify them correctly.
Case in point, my tuner told me that they swapped in some older Pro1s in a B20vtec setup, 12:1CR, all that jazz. He said he was amazed when the setup actually LOST about 12wtq on the dyno. He tried everything he could, tune wise, and just couldn’t get them to make the power back. Re-installed the newer Tuner1s and immediatly showed gaines over the Pro1s. With things constantly changing and getting better, its hard to know exactly what cam you’re getting.
That being said, Skunk cams offer a huge variety of cams that will let you chose the exact one that would best fit your setup… My tuner is also raving about Endyn’s Bumpsticks camshafts. He says they make awesome power throughout the powerband.
I took most of that over to my thread…
You’re brother’s B16 sounds sick. There was an issue with the first generation Pro1 cams. A guy at King Motorsport I talked to this summer mentioned how they could idle or they could make good power up top, but not both. If I am remembering correctly, it had to do with the centerline being off between the primary and secondary lobes…whoops! Can’t fix that shit with tuning.
As far as the bumpstix are concerned, in the great tradition of the internet, I will pass along that I read that a guy who talked to Larry was told that the bumpstix had the same Primaries as an ITR and the JUN type 3 profile as the starting profile for the Secondaries. Someone further chimed in that they have “a more gentle lift off, closing, and seating of the valve to reduce valvetrain wear.” as compared to the JUN 3. Probably a great cam. Larry has always hyped himself as being concerned with valvetrain wear. Upon further reading, I guess he has been making them for years, so the cam itself is probably a good piece from a materials standpoint as well.
Just skimmed thru some of this conversation. I know you guys are just joshing, but for the record I hate that I’m actually recommending Skunk2 products…
Colin – That’s what makes it so funny!
But I’ll be good and stop teasing you about it. 
Besides, it isn’t like you really recommend anything by them other than cams and I, too, reluctantly accept that they really are the best thing going in a lot of cases (as far as cams go).
Unified, your brother’s setup looks very sick even if the mugen oil cap and radiator cap make him look like a poser. 
Fortunately the hot Skunk2 socks make it drool-worthy again; It is a shame it is in a civic. (That is a 96-00 civic, right?)
At first I thought the A/F line was the torque curve and was like “holy crap that baby is flat! But why does it peak sometime before 3k rpms?”
It looks like that graph has a bit more smoothing that I usually see, but it still looks very good for a B16. Pretty cool.
Hah yeah its been a fun B16, for sure. The Mugen oil/rad cap were simply because he needed an oil cap… So after a night of surfing eGay, he found the product that he wanted
And the socks DO match his engine bay, so I suppose that counts for something… And yes, its a '98 Civic Coupe.
As far as the smoothing goes on the dyno, I really have no clue how much the tuner/dyno smooth’d it, as I wasnt there when it was done. I can say though that this thing screams. There is no harsh vtec crossover and it feels very smooth… It wants to go higher than 9500rpm, and it continues to make torque… But the peak HP drops off, so it makes sense not to take it higher than 9/9,500.
In retrospect, even with the biggest pistons that will fit in the block without causing PTV contact, the motor is over-cam’d. The b16 doesnt have the compression numbers (unless its bored/sleeved bigger than 81mm) to make the best out of this aggressive of a cam. If he dropped to a Tuner1 or even a Tuner2 I believe his peak HP would drop a little, but his Useable-Power would increase and result in a better powerband. Yadda yadda, needless to say, my brother says he won’t build another NA B16 lol.