OK, I’m going to try and make this post as simple and direct as possible. I do auto crossing and eventually will venture to circuit when I get more money to afford that.
My Problem: Driving the car feels very sloppy and my steering response is very crappy. It is extremely bad for auto crossing because it feels like I don’t get any feedback. I noticed recently my steering rack boots are ripped and oil and or grease is under the steering rack where the cover is. I also noticed that all my outer tie rods on both sides have ripped boots also. My lower ball joint boots are also ripped that were replaced about a year ago (non oem). Of course these problems came after I’ve been auto crossing and driving extremely hard on the car. As a result it feels like my steering response is totally crap now. Please don’t tell me to take out power steering because that’s not an option, so PLEASE DON’T MENTION TAKING OUT POWER STEERING.
What I want to do: I want to replace my steering rack with possibly a better, which I’ve acquired one that doesn’t have ripped boots and looks in ok condition, but will probably replace boots on it just for good measure. Along with it, I want to get new Honda OEM outer tie rods and new lower ball joints; upper ball joints are not ripped and seem to be well, so I don’t think I will waste money on that. I was wondering how important is it to get new inner tie rods? Should I? My main concern is that I want to replace my bushings in the control arms and rear trailing arm.
Choices for bushings: Should I go Honda OEM bushings for the control arms and other components that needs new bushings? Or the option of the ES bushing kit. Also, I’m really trying hard to find out what new rear trailing arm bushing I shall go with keeping in mind that I DAILY this car everyday and is my only car and is used for auto crossing also.
My suspension setup:
Tokico Illumina Shocks
Swift 12k Front, 10k Rear springs on coil over sleeves
Suspension Techniques Front 24mm and Rear 19mm Sway bar
awww c’mon matt u know the answers to all these questions. but regarding ur rack, if u are gonna change it out anyways, u might as well get the es bushings for the rack n pinion and all the boots fr it as well.
inner tie rods are kind of a measure and helps with piece of mind. inner tie rods don’t get much stress but he seal within the rack is whats an issue. so ppl change it out since they gotta remove stuff anyways. regarding ur ball joints, and outer tie rods tho there isn’t much choice left on those. some opt for the es boots for them. whichever i guess.
regarding the trailing arm bushings… thats basically you’re choice. either go oem… or go with ES. u do auto-x but i dunno from personal experience regarding that one. i believe as long as u replace it its better than the old beat up one thats in there now.
I was just wondering since I daily drive my car how much harsher would the ride be if i put es bushings on the control arms and rear trailing arm. As for the inner tie rods I guess it’s not that important to replace. The es bushings are cheaper of course, but I also don’t want a crazy stiff bumpy ride even though I have stiff springs already.
If you want a more OEM feel and longevity, then go for the Honda bushings for the front/rear LCAs. For the TA bushings, either OEM, Mugen, or the Noltec pieces (still can find the blue version for DC arms). I’m running the Noltecs on my daily and it’s real smooth! I’ve always been under the impression that ES and Prothane have binding issues, so I’d stay away from those. You might as well replace the inner tie rods too, that way there is no question that they don’t need replaced down the road. And always buy OEM!
nah the es bushings for the control arms for the front and rear will just stiffen up ur suspension and feel back to about new status. it is firmer than brand new oem bushings but its not much of a difference when u compare new to new. its just that when we put es bushings after having such torn worn out oem bushings, its like WHOA. thats all.
[QUOTE=hybrid90;2038370]Really? It was like WHOA? Damn I’m sold like a two dolla whore!
Man I gotta get off my ass and change the front bushings to ES ones… the fronts are toooooorn UP![/QUOTE]
lol. :stfu: hahaha jk man. yea man get on it. i got some spare rear lca’s from andee, so i can just put my es bushings on that one and have it ready for when i actually do my suspension.
i still need to order the ones for the front lca’s tho.
hey matt. since u have a spare rack n pinion. u might as well do the valve removal out of the good one. then loop it up. cuz… quite honestly power steering can’t handle the slalom or such quick maneuvers. the power steering whether with a pump or electronically assisted… it just can’t keep up. and u doing the looping trick if u remove the valves would be the best of both worlds.
ur power steering pump might bust its seals soon enough especially when we’re out at the track. if anything u’ll cause a huge mess in ur engine bay or even on the track. and that would suck nuts. you’d be dnfmatt and be the guy that spilled power steering fluid on the track too.
LOL, I need power steering because it’s my daily. No way I’m taking the power steering out unless I had another daily drivable car. The slalom is not the problem, I actually have the problem doing extremely hard cornering where as the wheel is losing traction and I’m not feeling the response when I’m countering the steering.
So, it seems that I might go with the OEM rear trailing arm and probably get the ES bushing kit for the control arms and other items. I know I can’t build a super track beast knowing that my car is my daily, but I want it to perform well enough to where I’m happy. Right now I am not happy with mainly the steering feel and response. When I first got this car the response was GREAT. Mainly because none of the boots were ripped, I did not have a leaky power steering rack, my ball joints were great and tie rods. All I want is to achieve the response I used to have or possibly better.
Oh by the way, I actually finished at the auto cross on Sunday. I spun out on the 2nd run which made me DNF though, but the 3rd run I finished because I was afraid I would spin out again with the extreme over steer I had having the rear shocks set at full stiff with my new spring setup was just crazy over steer.
hehe. good to hear man. i would’ve gone but had too many things going on, and i was low on funds again.
but regarding the power steering. if u looped the system its still pretty tough. but if u follow the teg tips article where u remove the inner valves of the rack… there is no pressure to overcome now. u make it into a manual rack but personally i think its even better. cuz u will be replacing the boots and bushings. and you’ll have an entirely closed system. less weight and u’ll think u have power steering in there cuz there will be lil resistance
I wish I could feel someone’s car whose done that, otherwise I’m too weary of doing that since I love the power steering for daily driving. Someone, let me test drive their car with no power steering done the right way
now that my curiosity has been tickled… how do u put oem trailing arm bushings? are they pressed in? or are they pressed in but with some glue? i really really don’t know.
They’re pressed in, no glue or anything,. That’s just white lithium on there:
Here’s why not to use PolyUrethane back there: “In any case the [trailing arm] bushing installation must allow lateral plunge, and rotation about an axis roughly parallel to the centerline of the car, thru the range of motion (there is lateral displacement of the arm, and there IS bump steer, and there’s very little you can do about it - therefore if you don’t have allowance for plunge and said non-axial rotation, you will have binding forces). The Poly type bushing setups I’ve seen don’t adequately account for this - and you can have problems, in some cases big problems.” http://honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=493789 also http://www.performanceforum.com/wesvann/honda/bushing/bushing.html
Stock height:
Lowered
curious. so is that an oem TA bushing? asking due to color of the rubber and it not looking like the ones in the pics of the oem ones in the links u provided.
It’s the same price as the Honda OEM Rear trailing arm from Honda OEM websites. Now, the other thing is Honda OEM control arm bushings come out to about $200!!! Which includes the 2 each for front lower arm bushings and 3 bushings for each rear lower control arm. Would it be a good idea to have the Mugen rear trailing arm bushings with Energy suspension control arm bushings? I would love to go OEM bushings for the control arms but $200 is kind of steep. Any inputs?
