I’ll get a pic of the fender braces once we have a chance to really test them out. But from the looks of them, customers will be very happy.
Pics of the original prototype hood dampers as promised. Note that the brackets you see were the mock ups. Production pieces will have machined brackets cut to fit, and will be available in black, bronze, or brushed stainless finishes. There are some kinks to work out as far as fit, but these are the test pieces on my own car. I like to test things out as much as possible. The first round wouldn’t stand up to much abuse. These I’ve literally thrown open and they are very sturdy.
jdmb16b. ive been working on a bracing schematic that i think you will be very interested in taking a look at. its by far the simplest design ive seen on here yet and equally, if not more functional. the design consists of a set of what i call upper fender braces in combination with a strut bar and set of side fender braces. since iceman already has the side fender braces worked out and im currently using a neuspeed strut bar (which i dont want to change and if you had one you’d know why), the only work that will have to be done is the fabrication of the upper fender braces. i also want to work an engine torque damper into the equation and will probably link it to the firewall or the fenderwell body itself, and NOT going to the upper strut tower bar (for very good reason :)). ive got a pretty good pic of what im trying to do, ill have someone host it later. iceman, if you guys like what ive worked up, and want to produce my design let me know, all id want would be a discounted set and some props :).
i got a pic, do u want to host it for me? halo 3 huh? i like it from what ive played. i loved the first one and utterly hated the second one. i really like the way they made the enemies respond to body and headshots differently. they are pretty tough unless you dome them. still think any kind of overshielding or invisibility is :gay: . real shooting skills ownz everytime. arg… another random tangent… sorry… lemme know if u can host that pic.
sent. ill explain why that will work better than a three point strut bar or a y-brace when he posts it. looking at it its kind of obvious, plus it looks a LOT better than either of those setups and leaves you a ton more room to work. i dont know if you guys have a lot of stuff around your manifold but i use a nxl kit and a single stage nx single nozzle so im up in there all the time. the neuspeed bar leaves the perfect amount of room and a three point would crowd that area so much. these braces i designed to work in conjunction with fender braces for best results. iceman has that end taken care of.
that is very similar to your design, but not the same. here is why… when engineering something you have to keep it as simple as possible. with upper and side fender braces, there is absolutely no need at all whatsoever for a three point strut bar. the fender braces support the up and down movement of the front of the car in relation to the firewall. those forces are distributed to and controlled by those bars, primarily (if you’ve had physics you know why i say this). the strut bar supports the fenders (the same structure) as well, but at a different point. those forces (exerted by the shock absorber) push the tops of the strut towers in towards eachother. the strut bar’s job is to control those forces primarily. jdmb16b… whats different about my design is that im using a lot less metal to achieve the same end result. less weight, better performance, more underhood room… all good things. im not knocking the 3-pt, im just saying its not necessary and the same job can be accomlished with two upper fender brace links and two side fender braces… remember we dont want to overbrace anything and add unnecessary weight. if you went the three point route, you wouldnt need the upper fender brace links like you have drawn in in that design. the 2 things that makes the two links better than the three point design is this: 1) all the forces on the three point bar are directed at one central point in the firewall (more prone to flex than two spread out points on the same surface) 2)the forces exerted by the shocks are directly being applied to the firewall in that same point. this necessitates a thicker, stronger, and potentially uglier bar. in my design everything thats accomplished by connecting the strut bar to the firewall is done more effectively by the upper and side fender braces. we want to achieve the most rigidity possible with the least amount of added weight using the thinnest, most aesthetically pleasing material possible. jdmb16b i like your design a lot and im not saying that mine is better than yours for your car, or mine, or anyone elses for that matter, but certainly that it is equally effective and more efficient, (and certainly lighter weight). one thing i need for you to clear up for me though… im not sure what the links at the front are supposed to do. there isnt any performance-detracting flexing going on there that im aware of or can conceive of, but i dont know everything so if it is there please enlighten me :). now, here is what i REALLY like about your design… 2 thing… 1)look at the passenger side upper fender brace link. its a v-shape, meaning that you, as i did, looked at that angled mounting bracket that kind of sticks out from the firewall and thought… man thats the perfect place to tie into but it could be a lot stronger of a mount (it comes off the firewall as opposed to being a nut welded into the firewall, stronger). the V-link ties into another nut thats welded in the firewall. the V-link there is definately the way to go and i will incorporate that into my design when i help my welder fab these up. 2) the engine torque damper is in the ideal spot, and i think we all agreed upon that. keeping the forces that the motor exerts on the chassis separate from the forces the chassis is exerting on itself (or that the road and suspension are exerting on it) is a key design element. it shows forthought and understanding of force distributions. then the now braced fenderwell structure can act as a support structure for the torque damper and the forces that it exerts on the strut towers do not act directly on our bars/bracing, keeping them lighter and stronger, with less overall stress applied to them :).
dang guys, we have brought all these designs a long way. i cant wait to turn it into reality.
how hard to you have to think about it to realize that you dont need to double brace the fenderwells to the firewall? at some point you stop making noticeable or measureable advances in rigidity and start adding unnecessary weight and cluttering the engine bay. i like being able to access my fuel rail and intake manifold area and a three point bar totally screws that up. i really think a good solid two point (be it neuspeed or whatever) is all thats needed. the strut tower bar helps you maintain alignment at the point when your chassis normally starts to flex. where do you think the firewall is most prone to flex, at the center or at the edges? you have to choose the bracing points carefully… and you have to k.i.s.s… look, the ONLY point im really trying to make here is this: the two upper braces and a two point bar are as good or better than a single solid three point bar…(and that you only need one of them, so it should be a choice), NOTHING else.
Would not the position of the damper put stress on the joint of the damper itself where it attaches to the block? More as wear it more and eventually damaging it?
jdmb16b… i think you will be much happier if you do it like that bc you can still access your intake and fuel rail. the green line along the firewall is the firewall right? not a bar? if not, two v-links will do the same thing.
dateglover… i dont think it would be that much of a problem as they chose the same mounting location for the motor mount. where do you think would be a better location to mount it?
yea bro thats the way to do it. for sure… looks clean and functional! what are the green squares around the mounting point? reinforcement? guys, what we have basically generated here is a slightly different version of pat’s y-brace. the theory behind bracing this way is sound and i think we all agree on that. now the nitty gritty… constructing it! there isnt much room to fab stuff on top of the tower, but there is room, so we have to keep things tight in there. open your hood and imagine building this thing where the bumpstop currently is and you will see what im talking about. we know its doable bc pat did it with his y-brace… as far as materials go i think mild steel is suitable bc the v-links are very small and shouldnt be a large gauge tube at all (one of the reasons for going with two links :)) so the piece should remain fairly lightweight even though it isnt chromoly. any fabbers have any recommendations on thickness of the bases? im thinking somewhere between 1/8" and 1/4". ill go ponder this over the hollidays… who is ready for turkey??
One thing, some of Jdmb16b concept have bar on the front of the engine bay that link the shock tower to the upper radiator support. Any thougts about this??
I think the DA radiator support need to be strenghtened (sp?). Maybe we can gain stability or handling there.
